Author Topic: OC Questions I have yet to find a clear answer for  (Read 2514 times)

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Offline PaulC

  • Posts: 70
OC Questions I have yet to find a clear answer for
« on: June 18, 2011, 09:01:14 AM »
According to MCL 28.425o 28.425o: Subsection (3)(1) "premises" does not include parking lots.

Now in MCL 750.234d750.234d it makes NO mention of parking lots.

Does that mean you must have a cpl in order to be in the parking lot while OC?

Another question...

I see no mention of malls... period. Unless the mall has a No Weapons sign (private property rights), I read no reason as to why I could no OC in a place like Great Lakes Crossing. With that being said, there are establishments with Liquor Licenses in the mall. Where do the boundaries apply there? The parking lot is obviously very large and surrounds the entire mall.

Another question... When exiting my car and un-storing my pistol, would I not be temporarily "brandishing" my gun while I loaded, cocked and holstered my pistol?

I know these seem silly, but I want to be 100% certain that I am in compliance with the law and I do not want to risk an infraction while I am working towards a cpl.

I realize that Open cary becomes MUCH easier with a cpl and I realize that I am limited to where I can OC without one.

Another question... I have a UCG tactical holster... I have OC'ed in my house and yard and tried to have someone take my gun out or rip my holster off of me... I am comfortable that my pistol is secure but I would like to get something a little more rigid. Unfortunately there is not an abundance of SR40 holsters. Safariland does not have Ruger SR40 holsters as of yet. Suggestions are welcomed. :)

"Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power."

-- Yoshimi Ishikawa, Japanese author

Offline Greyh Seer

  • Posts: 164
Re: OC Questions I have yet to find a clear answer for
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2011, 12:32:27 PM »
The SR40 has almost identical dimensions to the SR9.  Almost any holster for the SR9 should work for the SR40 perfectly.  A Blackhawk Serpa retention holster for the SR9 should work nicely for your needs.  I would suggest finding one at a gun store and trying it out.  (of course be sure to bring your firearm in unloaded and ask the store clerks first (usually they will let you use one of the ones they have in the case).

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-Greyh

Offline PaulC

  • Posts: 70
Re: OC Questions I have yet to find a clear answer for
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2011, 02:21:46 PM »
Heard bad things about guns getting stuck in them.
"Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power."

-- Yoshimi Ishikawa, Japanese author

Offline Greyh Seer

  • Posts: 164
Re: OC Questions I have yet to find a clear answer for
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2011, 02:38:12 PM »
Heard bad things about guns getting stuck in them.

I haven't heard that.  I know I haven't had any issues, but then again mine is still rather new.  Either way, if you are looking for something else, I know that almost any holster you can get for the SR9 would work for the SR40.  I would suggest going to a few gun shops and trying different options.  I think I went to 4 or 5 before deciding on my starting options.
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-Greyh

Offline METL

  • Posts: 632
Re: OC Questions I have yet to find a clear answer for
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2011, 03:34:37 PM »
The SERPA is an ok holster... but frankly, I like my Safariland ALS holster MUCH better...   

Offline Bronson

  • Posts: 554
Re: OC Questions I have yet to find a clear answer for
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2011, 12:21:37 PM »

Does that mean you must have a cpl in order to be in the parking lot while OC? 

Yes.  You may also OC in the FFZs listed in 750.234d without a CPL if you have permission from the owner or owner's agent (I'd suggest you get it in writing).

I see no mention of malls... period. Unless the mall has a No Weapons sign (private property rights), I read no reason as to why I could no OC in a place like Great Lakes Crossing. With that being said, there are establishments with Liquor Licenses in the mall. Where do the boundaries apply there? The parking lot is obviously very large and surrounds the entire mall.

This is all my opinion.  There is nothing illegal about carrying in a mall, unless they ask you leave and you refuse then you may be arrested for trespassing.  As far as the businesses with a LL in the mall I'd say the alcohol restriction on carrying would only apply to the specific areas that they lease from the mall.

Another question... When exiting my car and un-storing my pistol, would I not be temporarily "brandishing" my gun while I loaded, cocked and holstered my pistol?

http://www.ag.state.mi.us/opinion/datafiles/2000s/op10176.htm

Quote
In the absence of any reported Michigan appellate court decisions defining "brandishing," it is appropriate to rely upon dictionary definitions. People v Denio, 454 Mich 691, 699; 564 NW2d 13 (1997). According to The American Heritage Dictionary, Second College Edition (1982), at p 204, the term brandishing is defined as: "1. To wave or flourish menacingly, as a weapon. 2. To display ostentatiously. –n. A menacing or defiant wave or flourish." This definition comports with the meaning ascribed to this term by courts of other jurisdictions. For example, in United States v Moerman, 233 F3d 379, 380 (CA 6, 2000), the court recognized that in federal sentencing guidelines, "brandishing" a weapon is defined to mean "that the weapon was pointed or waved about, or displayed in a threatening manner." 

This is all just a layman's opinion and should not be taken as legal advice.  You should always seek licensed and competent legal counsel for all questions of law.

Bronson
Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. – Thomas Paine