Author Topic: Couple things I want to be clear on  (Read 1603 times)

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Offline MoToX20

  • Posts: 3
Couple things I want to be clear on
« on: June 27, 2011, 03:38:32 PM »
I read it a couple different ways, with a CPL do you need permission to OC in a PFZ from the property owner? 750.234d and Legal Update No. 86 just says CPL holders are exempt but doesn't mention needing permission. This is from the "New to open carry Start Here" thread: "An AG opinion, the MSP and Senator Prusi stated that a person with a CPL can carry a firearm openly in the exempted areas listed in MCL 750.234d.  For example, with permission from the owner you can openly carry a handgun in a bar, sports arena, etc.  " 

Private property laws state that if the owner of the land/property asks me to leave or not carry a weapon on their property I have to obey their demands and leave, but what constitutes private property exactly. Say if I walked into McDonald's and the manager asked me to leave, is that the same or does that have to come from the Corporate office, basically who is considered the owner of a chain-type business? Private Property is defined as "land or belongings owned by a person or group and kept for their exclusive use", so I just want to make sure what the law actually says about this because if they invite the public in then it's not kept for "their exclusive use".

If businesses can ban anyone from carrying a weapon can someone link the state law that stipulates the requirements. Thanks all

Offline Bronson

  • Posts: 554
Re: Couple things I want to be clear on
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2011, 03:05:05 AM »
750.234d lists places where you may not legally possess a firearm unless you meet one of the exemptions; the two most pertinent for us being 1) a CPL and 2) having permission.  If you have a CPL you are exempt from the restrictions listed in .234d and are not breaking that law.  However the property owners may still ask you to leave, which is their right.  If you refuse to leave you are then breaking MCL 750.552-Trespassing (and possibly any local trespass ordinances that may be in effect).

Quote
750.552 Trespass upon lands or premises of another; violation; penalty.

Sec. 552.

(1) A person shall not do any of the following:

(a) Enter the lands or premises of another without lawful authority after having been forbidden so to do by the owner or occupant or the agent of the owner or occupant.

(b) Remain without lawful authority on the land or premises of another after being notified to depart by the owner or occupant or the agent of the owner or occupant.

(c) Enter or remain without lawful authority on fenced or posted farm property of another person without the consent of the owner or his or her lessee or agent. A request to leave the premises is not a necessary element for a violation of this subdivision. This subdivision does not apply to a person who is in the process of attempting, by the most direct route, to contact the owner or his or her lessee or agent to request consent.

(2) A person who violates subsection (1) is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in the county jail for not more than 30 days or by a fine of not more than $250.00, or both.

There is some spririted and lively debate as to what exactly constitutes private property and the difference between private property and privately owned property that has public accomodation.  I'll leave that for others but right now what I've posted above is how it normally works.

Bronson
Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. – Thomas Paine