OC - Wheelchair'd Veteran

[Fopper]

I have just learned of Michigan Open Carry, Inc today talking with a local political candidate.  I applaud you.

I have read nearly all the posts made here, and have been amazed at the great information provided.  However, I do have a few questions...

I have to use an electric wheelchair (along with a service dog) to get around the majority of the time.  But trust me, helping keep our freedoms free, was worth the price I and others have paid.

My problem...

How is the world do I carry open in an electric (scooter) wheelchair?  I used to have a CPL but did not renew it when my health got worse for a few years.  I may reapply, but honestly would prefer carrying open.   Any ideas on how to do this.  I figure I can leave the weapon with my chair in the back of my van when I travel places, because no one, but my service dog, has access to that area.  But I do not know if carrying it, for instance, in a holster connected to my belt, while seated in a wheelchair may not constitute carrying concealed.

I might get my dog to carry it on a holster from his vest....but I think that might make some folks really unhappy.  Yes, I am teasing about that.  Although, he is big enough to do so.  :-)

Let me know what you think.

Thanks,

Fopper

[CV67PAT]

Sitting in a wheelchair for you is no different than me sitting in a restaurant booth. The clothing covering the pistol is what causes it to become concealed. However, if you should utilize a shawl, you should pay particular attention to not cover the pistol. This may be considered concealing. In any case, I am certain that you wouldn't have the pistol buried so far behind you that it couldn't be deployed rapidly if necessary.

As far as storing the pistol in the chair during transport, unloaded and ammo separated from the pistol is required. Having a CPL is so very helpful in transporting and expanding the areas that a loaded pistol can be lawfully possessed.

And a heartfelt thanks from one warrior to another.

[northofnowhere]

If the dog has a CPL, or the gun is registered tot he dog, he is covered, otherwise you may want to keep it on you.  Other then that, Pat has it pretty well stated, and I concur with all teh thoughts he has conveyed to you.

In addition, welcome to the website, and the world of open carry.  Feel free to think up more questions, we get bored in the wee hours of the night and need something to do.

-jason r.

[CV67PAT]

But if it is a retired police dog, I don't think he needs a CPL.

[ocdetroit]

  Pat. Welcome Fopper. Carry On.

[ocdetroit]

But your right. Carry On.

[venator]

would the electric wheelchair be considered a vehicle?

A shoulder holster may work in a wheelchair.  Crossdraw holster at 11:00 may be an option.

[METL]

I 2nd the shoulder rig...


Also, keep in mind that unless you case the gun and have it unloaded you can get in trouble transporting it without a CPL.   


You can still OC if you have a CPL.  I would look into getting that back in order, then you won't have to worry about it... but could OC until your heart's content...


I would def. mount a turret to the dog's back. 

[Christian Patriot]

Though I understand your thoughts on transport, that wheelchair/scooter is essentially his legs now. I also assume that the wheelchair/scooter is his only meens of getting from the house to the mailbox. I would think that the chair would be safe from transport laws but the scooter becomes the real issue.? I would defenitly make sure the weapon is in plain view. That scooter probably goes 5 mph (a brisk walking speed). I understand that the transport laws are not based on speed, but... Just a point of interest.

Daniel

[CV67PAT]

The "scooter" is a "chair".

You may have seen a "scooter". But not recognized it, because it looks almost like a "chair".

[Fopper]

Hi Everyone,

I want to say thank you for everyone's thoughts and ideas.  I am truly impressed.  For clarification, I am a female, not a male.  But with a nickname like Fopper, it would be hard to pin the sex easily.

I am going to look at the shoulder holder option for OC.  Yes, the scooter/wheelchair is hard to differentiate between.  However, saying an electric wheelchair confuses folks as well.  It is a nice little get-up and has given me back part of my freedom. 

I tried to have a long talk with my service dog, he was trained with a couple Police Dogs as well as a SAR dog, so he is pretty sure he can easily qualify for a CPL.  He loved the idea of mounting a turret on his back and figures we can store the extra ammo in his vest.  So if any of you see a beautiful standard poodle with a bright yellow vest with a turret on top walking with the gal in a chair....you can pretty much guess it is me.

I think I need to go shopping tomorrow.

[Fopper]

Patrick, Thank you as well.  ~Pam

[onnie0047@gmail.com]

would the electric wheelchair be considered a vehicle?

A shoulder holster may work in a wheelchair.  Crossdraw holster at 11:00 may be an option.

Jeff you know better:::: NO!

257.13c “Electric personal assistive mobility device” defined.
Sec. 13c. “Electric personal assistive mobility device” means a self-balancing nontandem 2-wheeled
device, designed to transport only 1 person at a time, having an electrical propulsion system with average
power of 750 watts or 1 horsepower and a maximum speed on a paved level surface of not more than 15 miles
per hour.
History: Add. 2002, Act 494, Imd. Eff. July 3, 2002.

[onnie0047@gmail.com]

Though I understand your thoughts on transport, that wheelchair/scooter is essentially his legs now. I also assume that the wheelchair/scooter is his only meens of getting from the house to the mailbox. I would think that the chair would be safe from transport laws but the scooter becomes the real issue.? I would defenitly make sure the weapon is in plain view. That scooter probably goes 5 mph (a brisk walking speed). I understand that the transport laws are not based on speed, but... Just a point of interest.

Daniel

in part they are, to be listed a personal transport device they may not exceed 15 miles per hour

257.13c “Electric personal assistive mobility device” defined.
Sec. 13c. “Electric personal assistive mobility device” means a self-balancing nontandem 2-wheeled
device, designed to transport only 1 person at a time, having an electrical propulsion system with average
power of 750 watts or 1 horsepower and a maximum speed on a paved level surface of not more than 15 miles
per hour.
History: Add. 2002, Act 494, Imd. Eff. July 3, 2002.

[venator]

would the electric wheelchair be considered a vehicle?

A shoulder holster may work in a wheelchair.  Crossdraw holster at 11:00 may be an option.

Jeff you know better:::: NO!

257.13c “Electric personal assistive mobility device” defined.
Sec. 13c. “Electric personal assistive mobility device” means a self-balancing nontandem 2-wheeled
device, designed to transport only 1 person at a time, having an electrical propulsion system with average
power of 750 watts or 1 horsepower and a maximum speed on a paved level surface of not more than 15 miles
per hour.
History: Add. 2002, Act 494, Imd. Eff. July 3, 2002.

So, it's defined in a statute, but is it a "vehicle" or is it not?  Under a definition of vehicle it very well may be.  Gray area at best, which is why I raised it. 

[CV67PAT]

would the electric wheelchair be considered a vehicle?

A shoulder holster may work in a wheelchair.  Crossdraw holster at 11:00 may be an option.

Jeff you know better:::: NO!

257.13c “Electric personal assistive mobility device” defined.
Sec. 13c. “Electric personal assistive mobility device” means a self-balancing nontandem 2-wheeled
device, designed to transport only 1 person at a time, having an electrical propulsion system with average
power of 750 watts or 1 horsepower and a maximum speed on a paved level surface of not more than 15 miles
per hour.
History: Add. 2002, Act 494, Imd. Eff. July 3, 2002.

This is NOT a wheelchair.

[TheQ]

Here comes the on versus in debate.

Here's what I'd say -- avoid trip ups, get a CPL regardless, they you can OC while grocery shopping.

[CV67PAT]

Here comes the on versus in debate.

Here's what I'd say -- avoid trip ups, get a CPL regardless, they you can OC while grocery shopping.

Why any on vs in debate if a wheelchair isn't even a vehicle?

[onnie0047@gmail.com]

would the electric wheelchair be considered a vehicle?

A shoulder holster may work in a wheelchair.  Crossdraw holster at 11:00 may be an option.

Jeff you know better:::: NO!

257.13c “Electric personal assistive mobility device” defined.
Sec. 13c. “Electric personal assistive mobility device” means a self-balancing nontandem 2-wheeled
device, designed to transport only 1 person at a time, having an electrical propulsion system with average
power of 750 watts or 1 horsepower and a maximum speed on a paved level surface of not more than 15 miles
per hour.
History: Add. 2002, Act 494, Imd. Eff. July 3, 2002.

So, it's defined in a statute, but is it a "vehicle" or is it not?  Under a definition of vehicle it very well may be.  Gray area at best, which is why I raised it.

I  misinterpreted your response once again as being tongue and cheek....I will do some research, I would not think it would be considered a vehicle, but I have often been wrong, I am busy and off on vacation over the next few weeks, but I will see what I may be able to dig up or try to get some kind of an opinion!