Author Topic: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad  (Read 9802 times)

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Offline tunasnacks

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Hello all! My name is Matt and I am from the Commerce area. Still waiting for my CPL to get here so I decided that I would open carry until then. I've been doing a lot of reading and studying in regards to the laws and statutes that need to be known before OC'ing. I recently purchased a lovely Sprinfield XD SC. I love this thing.

Today I decided to OC and take it slow. I had one great experience and one poor experience.

Good:

Went to Gander Mountain in Novi to see if they had the Blackhawk Serpa 2 holster in stock. While I was at work I was on their site and knew that they fully support both OC and CC of their patrons so this was not a concern. I went to the store and holstered my weapon after unlocking it from my trunk. Walked in making sure that no ill conceived manager put a sign up or anything. Walked to the firearms department to search for the holster. Had no looks of terror as this is Gander Mountain  ;) .  A sales rep asked if I needed any help and I inquired about the holster. Unfortunately they did not have it in stock so I thanked him for his help and just browsed around looking at some other stuff. Went to my car and locked the firearm back up.

Bad:

After Gander Mountain I thought that Dicks Sporting Goods in Fountain Walk might have the holster I'm looking for. I unlocked my firearm and holstered in. Before walking in I scanned their doorway for any notice or sign that states that firearms are not allowed to be OC or CC. There were none. However they are having a 4th of July sale! Walked in with no issue. Went up the escalator to the firearm area. Not lingering around or browsing as I was walking directly to there. I browsed around and quickly came to the conclusion that they do not even have any holsters. Walked straight back to the escalator. As I was walking back out towards the exit the door greeter had stopped me and asked if I found what I was looking for. I kindly informed them that I did not. (Mind you this is the same door greeter that I walked passed as I was walking in). He asked what I was looking for and I let him know. He then noticed that I was OC'ing. He told me that this was not allowed by store and company policy. I stated that I did not see a sign on the door and that OC was legal in Michigan to anyone who is legally allowed to posses a firearm. He said I was absurd and that he didn't think that it was true. "There would be some sever security issues if we just let anyone walk into our store with a weapon. The customers would be scared". I kindly smiled and informed him that a law abiding citizen would not OC a firearm to invoke fear but to exercise their right. A criminal that is concealing when not allowed is what you would need to worry about. He asked me to leave the store. I kindly obliged and let him know that I was on my way out regardless. This just gives me another reason not to go there. Not only are the rpices absurd but the way the situation was handled by whom I assume a kid that just graduated high school.

Anyhow, even though I had one bad experience this will not stop me from OC'ing. It will stop me from giving Dicks Sporting Goods my business though!

I look forward to OC events as well as learning and contributing to the forums!

Cheers!  8)

Offline TheQ

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2012, 07:32:53 PM »
If you haven't already...PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE become VERY familiar with the Laws around OC.

Read this thread:

http://forums.michiganopencarry.org/index.php/topic,25.0.html

If you think you are up to speed, answer this question: is it legal for you to Open Carry at Meijers (prior to you getting your CPL)?  How about your local Speedway?
I Am Not A Lawyer (nor a gunsmith).

Offline tunasnacks

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2012, 07:38:49 PM »
If you haven't already...PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE become VERY familiar with the Laws around OC.

Read this thread:

http://forums.michiganopencarry.org/index.php/topic,25.0.html

If you think you are up to speed, answer this question: is it legal for you to Open Carry at Meijers (prior to you getting your CPL)?  How about your local Speedway?

No I can't in Meijer as they sell alcohol. Also Speedway I would be in and out of my vehicle I would not even take it out of the trunk.

Offline tunasnacks

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2012, 07:42:19 PM »
Thank you for the link as well as I was reading it earlier today and forgot to bookmark it. I plan on making myself a laminated card to keep on my person in case I need it. And hey nothing wrong with a little extra studying while I am bored.

Offline TheQ

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2012, 07:52:07 PM »
If you haven't already...PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE become VERY familiar with the Laws around OC.

Read this thread:

http://forums.michiganopencarry.org/index.php/topic,25.0.html

If you think you are up to speed, answer this question: is it legal for you to Open Carry at Meijers (prior to you getting your CPL)?  How about your local Speedway?

No I can't in Meijer as they sell alcohol. Also Speedway I would be in and out of my vehicle I would not even take it out of the trunk.

Speedway also has a Liquor license (state wide) whether or not a particular location sells liquor.  People would debate about whether or not you are even allows to have it in your trunk.

http://forums.michiganopencarry.org/index.php/topic,1765.msg13009.html#msg13009
I Am Not A Lawyer (nor a gunsmith).

Offline tunasnacks

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2012, 10:20:48 PM »

Speedway also has a Liquor license (state wide) whether or not a particular location sells liquor.  People would debate about whether or not you are even allows to have it in your trunk.

http://forums.michiganopencarry.org/index.php/topic,1765.msg13009.html#msg13009

Thank you for the information.

Offline ocdetroit

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2012, 11:06:01 PM »
Welcome from Detroit. Carry On.
Open carry in Detroit
With both of them.

Offline Super Trucker

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2012, 09:48:05 AM »
Have you contacted the Manager of Dick's sporting goods to let them their door greeter is living up to the company name?

Offline springfield40xdm

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2012, 10:16:52 AM »
Welcome from Hartland

Offline tunasnacks

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2012, 11:15:27 AM »
Have you contacted the Manager of Dick's sporting goods to let them their door greeter is living up to the company name?

I actually contacted the store manager via the phone when I got to my car. She stated the same thing and sided with her door greeter.

Offline prospectpuppet

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2012, 04:10:33 AM »
Just a little friendly advice: be careful doing the whole "transport then OC" thing. If anyone (especially a LEO) sees you pull your weapon from the trunk to holster it, they could potentially get you for brandishing. Just make sure it stays hidden from the public eye until it's secured. Also, (correct me if I'm wrong) but I believe there are only certain locations you can "transport" a firearm to. And dicks isn't one of them. I've had my cpl for a while now so I can't remember that law exactly but I believe it's only places like a gunsmith or shooting range, etc. Anyway, just looking out. Be safe, have fun, carry on.

Brad
« Last Edit: July 25, 2012, 06:26:26 PM by yance »

Offline TheQ

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New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2012, 10:03:14 AM »
MCL 750.231a states a lawful purpose *includes* x, y, and z. The most important word there is "includes"...this not an exclusive list.

The MSP seems to suggest otherwise in MSP Legal Update 86 indicating this could be a grey area (even though it's black and white language). The "safest" advise is always to get a CPL.

IANAL and this post isn't legal advice.
I Am Not A Lawyer (nor a gunsmith).

Offline yance

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Re: New from Commerce. First Day OC'ing. One good experience... one bad
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2012, 06:26:41 PM »
Just a little friendly advice: be careful doing the whole "transport then OC" thing. If anyone (especially a LEO) sees you pull your weapon from the trunk to holster it, they could potentially get you for brandishing. Just make sure it stays hidden from the public eye until it's secured. Also, (correct me if I'm wrong) but I believe there are only certain locations you can "transport" a firearm to. And dicks isn't one of them. I've had my cpl for a while now so I can't remember that law exactly but I believe it's only places like a gunsmith or shooting range, etc. Anyway, just looking out. Be safe, have fun, carry on.

Brad

A few years ago, to my knowledge, the laws were inclusive, meaning you could ONLY transport for those reasons.  However they were updated to state "to include" so that it listed a few examples but it didnt make it mandatory to only transport for those purposes, there is currently some legislation trying to make its way through that would eliminate the list and take away the listed places and leave it at "transportation for a lawful purpose"

Currently under the law someone can transport a firearm for OC, aside from the list including examples of some times when someone may transport it also states:

750.231a

(d) To a person while transporting a pistol for a lawful purpose that is licensed by the owner or occupant of the motor vehicle in compliance with section 2 of 1927 PA 372, MCL 28.422, and the pistol is unloaded in a closed case designed for the storage of firearms in the trunk of the vehicle.

As a law abiding citizen open carry would qualify as a "lawful purpose" as long as you are doing so within the confines of the law.