Author Topic: Update on My situation with the PPD (Read 27518 times)

army74 · « **on:** May 18, 2010, 11:21:48 AM »

I finally got a call from a Capt In Internal affairs told me he knows the law and im in violation of it and could be and would be arrested. Told me if i OC in pontiac i would be in violation of my cpl . i Called MSP in lansing they said they would call them give them the website and info on open carry. I gave a copy of the papers some sent me the link to for the LEO. Im still planning on attending the city council meeting on thursday night ill be there at 6:30 meeting starts at 7:00 i have to be early to fill out a communication card. Thanks for all the info and support/help. Carry On!!!!!!!!

army74 · « **Reply #1 on:** May 18, 2010, 12:08:22 PM »

I met with chief today looked at the paper work for the LEO paperwork i got from the weblink i was sent. Chief said all this is going to do is get someone killed. He would send it to city attorney to look over and check for the legality of it.The capt told me again that im still in violation of my cpl but it might be diffrent in difrrent areas. He said i could probally take i to court and win and that the state needs to redo the cpl so it goes along with the Open Carry. I dont want to be a test case but i guess i am and thats ok with me. Council meeting is Thursday i want to go but dont know if i should go or just wait for city attorney.Thanks ev1

autosurgeon · « **Reply #2 on:** May 18, 2010, 12:45:38 PM »

He is so far out in left field that the Hubble can't see him!

army74 · « **Reply #3 on:** May 18, 2010, 01:18:00 PM »

lol should i go to the council meeting and if i do my wifes dropping me off in case im going to be a night resident of the ppd

CoonDog · « **Reply #4 on:** May 18, 2010, 03:11:27 PM »

OC with a CPL is not illegal. There is no statute that says you MUST conceal. Similarly, there is no statute against printing or open carry. What, then, can they charge you with? If one of the CPL violations in 28.425f or 28.425o, then these are civil infractions that do not have associated jail time for the first violation. In any case, I don't see how either would apply to your scenario, but here they are for the record. Make sure you are recording for your own protection. Even better, have your wife go with you and hold the recorder in case the LEO tries to take it/shut it off.

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/%28S%28atwq3xysvsnaqefij3ofgwin%29%29/mileg.aspx?page=GetObject&objectname=mcl-28-425f

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/%28S%28ft44sibvddxvfk45w0xp4f55%29%29/mileg.aspx?page=GetObject&objectname=mcl-28-425o

Bronson · « **Reply #5 on:** May 18, 2010, 04:12:04 PM »

Quote from: army74 on May 18, 2010, 12:08:22 PM

The capt told me again that im still in violation of my cpl

Make him show you the law. If he shows you a local ordinance show him the state pre-emption law (linked below).

Quote from: army74 on May 18, 2010, 12:08:22 PM

but it might be diffrent in difrrent areas.

EEEEEHHH! WRONG! Thanks for playing, next contestant please. This is exactly why the firearms pre-emption law was enacted so that there WOULDN'T be different firearms laws throughout the state.

Quote from: army74 on May 18, 2010, 12:08:22 PM

He said i could probally take i to court and win

That means he knows he's wrong.

Bronson

NHCGRPR45 · « **Reply #6 on:** May 18, 2010, 09:03:06 PM »

maybe we need to show up at the council meeting and support this member who's having his rights trampled. "we" means other OC members they might arrest 1 person but i strongly believe that to do that with 5 or ten people would put some doubt in the chiefs policy.
shaun

NHCGRPR45 · « **Reply #7 on:** May 18, 2010, 09:19:37 PM »

will you be OC when you go before the council? because i will be. and like i said the more people we have the less like it will be that you or anyone will be arrested, also i doubt the city of pontiac would enjoy the news and press it would recieve from such an act, at least thats what i think anyway.

dtmartin408 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 18, 2010, 09:36:30 PM »

i think I'd be interested in going to the meeting and OCing.

stainless1911 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 18, 2010, 11:58:10 PM »

Im in too. As soon as I have a time and an adress, Ill clear my schedule for it. More than happy to help you Army.

army74 · « **Reply #10 on:** May 19, 2010, 06:49:27 AM »

meeting starts at 7pm but should be there by6:30 47450 woodward ave. pontiac mi 48342

stainless1911 · « **Reply #11 on:** May 19, 2010, 09:14:47 AM »

EXELENT

army74 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 19, 2010, 09:31:44 AM »

i think we might have 5 including myself coming to council meeting in pontiac michigan

venator · « **Reply #13 on:** May 19, 2010, 12:57:11 PM »

Quote from: army74 on May 19, 2010, 09:31:44 AM

i think we might have 5 including myself coming to council meeting in pontiac michigan

Send the chief this as well, it was settled out of court with a cash settlement and a lot of egg on the City's face.

May 12, 2009

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:

The Law Offices of Steven W. Dulan, PLC announces federal civil rights suit against City of Grand Haven and Ottawa County over open-carry ordinance.

The suit, brought under Title 42, Section 1983 of the U.S. Code, was filed on behalf of Christopher Fetters, an off-duty Air Force Security Officer who was attending the Coast Guard Festival in Grand Haven last year. Mr. Fetters was openly carrying a holstered pistol, which is legal under Michigan law, as in most states. He was arrested and detained and charged with a violation of a Grand Haven city ordinance prohibiting open carry of firearms. His gun was initially seized, although it was later returned.

Michigan law prohibits local units of government from making any law with respect to firearms, (MCL 123.1102.) The public policy goal of the statute is to provide a uniform system of gun laws statewide so that citizens do not have to guess regarding what local rules might exist as they move from one locality to the next.

The complaint alleges, among other issues, violations of Mr. Fetters' civil rights under the 2d, 4th, and 14th , Amendments to the U.S. Constitution, and Article I, Section 6 of the Michigan Constitution, which reads, "Every person has a right to keep and bear arms for the defense of himself and the state," when he was physically restrained, disarmed, and subjected to verbal harassment and ridicule by law enforcement personnel.

Criminal charges were later dropped by the Grand Haven City Attorney's Office, after being informed of the unenforceability of their ordinance. No allegations were ever made that Mr. Fetters ever threatened anyone, or in any other way disturbed the peace on the day of his arrest. He is demanding damages for violation of his civil rights as a citizen of the United States and of Michigan.

The case has been filed in the U.S. Court, Western District of Michigan in Grand Rapids and has been assigned Case Number 1:09-CV-00190.

Savage.Detroit · « **Reply #14 on:** May 19, 2010, 06:44:42 PM »

I'll be there tomorrow. I am coming from the Dearborn/Detroit area if anyone wants to car pool. I will be OCing w/o a CPL. So I guess in Pontiac's eyes I am good to go, LOL!

stainless1911 · « **Reply #15 on:** May 19, 2010, 09:34:32 PM »

I dont know if I can make it, I have to attempt to finish a painting job, and dont know if I can get free. We shall see.

dtmartin408 · « **Reply #16 on:** May 19, 2010, 11:18:21 PM »

I will not be able to make the city council meeting my wife has to work late and I've got our daughter then.

army74 · « **Reply #17 on:** May 19, 2010, 11:42:25 PM »

ok ty anyways i do appreciate it

NHCGRPR45 · « **Reply #18 on:** May 20, 2010, 01:43:46 AM »

when is the meeting? i can't find a time and date??? thanks
shaun

NHCGRPR45 · « **Reply #19 on:** May 20, 2010, 01:47:47 AM »

hello savage detroit i could use that ride! if your coming give me a call at 1 586 404 2082! thanks and carry on

shaun

stainless1911 · « **Reply #20 on:** May 20, 2010, 08:47:59 AM »

The meeting is:

6:30 p-m. @ 47450 Woodward Ave. Pontiac MI, 48342

DanM · « **Reply #21 on:** May 20, 2010, 11:05:50 AM »

Army74,

As I posted over on OCDO, be sure to be there and have your comment card submitted before 6PM. I think you confirmed you will be there between 5:30 and before 6:00. I'll be there before 6PM to submit my comment card, assuming that you accepted my proposal that you will summarize your incident(s) and what various officials have said to you, then I will speak to the council to summarize the legality of OC, that any alleged misinformation that is true should be corrected, and that MOC or other OC folks are available to them for further information, training, etc.

As to the questions on whether or not to OC, I will be OC'ing to this council meeting.

NHCGRPR45 · « **Reply #22 on:** May 20, 2010, 12:03:58 PM »

this is a message i got from the city council this morning...........

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm very sorry for any inconvenience that our Pontiac Police Department caused anyone with undue stress and harassment with a threaten behavior. I will forward this issue over to the Chief, and Mayor for follow up.
On behalf of the City of Pontiac I would like to thank you for informing us about this encounter.
Thank you
Lee A. Jones

>>> "shaun mcelroy" <shaunmcelroy76@yahoo.com> 5/18/2010 9:11 PM >>>

hello, I was wondering if you are aware that your police department has threatened an illegal and unlawful arrest of one of your citizens for openly carrying a firearm? it is legal in MI to do so and to have a officer threaten a citizen is very poor police work.

Shaun McElroy

DGerard · « **Reply #23 on:** May 20, 2010, 04:37:22 PM »

Hello Army74...I have been reading your experience with PPD and will be at council meeting to support and stand by our cause'...

Quball · « **Reply #24 on:** May 20, 2010, 11:11:04 PM »

Come on what is the update. I had to work tonight so I couldn't make it. What was the out come? Was ther a great showing and did MOC prove the point?

army74 · « **Reply #25 on:** May 20, 2010, 11:56:26 PM »

I think about 15 or so showed up tonight. There were really fit to be tied with me. We definitely got our point across. The city attorney said him and the chief are going to investigate it and the chief advised him not to make a comment at this time.But i do appreciate all the support from everyone who came out and everyone who couldn't make it.

cabman1 · « **Reply #26 on:** May 21, 2010, 08:37:30 AM »

Please send any Michigan Open Carry. Inc. media request to jayjayjay@hotmail.com his name is Jan Jay unless you would like to do the interview on behalf of yourself.Thanks Not that anyone isn't capable of doing a great interview but if we keep it uniform we will look like an unorganized group.

Thanks,
Gordon Cannon
Vice President
Michigan Open Carry,Inc

army74 · « **Reply #27 on:** May 21, 2010, 09:04:54 AM »

You may want to contact oakland press and ask for the city of pontiac reporter im not going to do the interview since im new at oc. Theres been enough focus on what happend to me i Think it should now be the focus of OC and the unjust ordinances should be the focus now ty.

stainless1911 · « **Reply #28 on:** May 21, 2010, 09:28:18 AM »

Keep us updated. I sincerely apologise for not being able to make this appointment. It was unavoidable.

TaxWhat · « **Reply #29 on:** May 21, 2010, 12:40:29 PM »

Thank You to ALL , Everyone please note MOC inc. Has a NEW plan ! Details to be posted soon . 734-657-3268----- jayjayjay40@hotmail.com Jeff S and cabman are onboard with it . God bless Jan Jay

FatboyCykes · « **Reply #30 on:** May 21, 2010, 10:08:44 PM »

Quote from: TaxWhat on May 21, 2010, 12:40:29 PM

Thank You to ALL , Everyone please note MOC inc. Has a NEW plan ! Details to be posted soon . 734-657-3268----- jayjayjay40@hotmail.com Jeff S and cabman are onboard with it . God bless Jan Jay

Welcome Tax!

army74 · « **Reply #31 on:** May 22, 2010, 08:47:37 AM »

Here is a link to the article that ran in todays Oakland Press.

http://www.theoaklandpress.com/articles/2010/05/22/news/local_news/doc4bf73c9c3b68b820871044.txt#story_comments

DetroitBiker · « **Reply #32 on:** May 23, 2010, 12:25:08 PM »

some of those replies are comical, they still dont get that OC is Legal. Here is a good one.. ToTo WAIT A MINUTES wrote on May 23, 2010 10:29 AM:

" You two did not read what I said. I SAID he is RIGHT DID YOU LEARN HOW TO READ. THE LAW Says it must be consealed you idiot. TAKE the class I did and I know what I am talking about. That is all I said. Ben Shattuck is as smart as a box of rocks. But you must conseal the weapon that is law. The gun must not be visible. There are places you can and cannot carry and you should know the difference. The word consealed means not visible. Ben has every right to carry a gun. But you must follow the law. You should not have it visible just to draw attention to yourself. He also should have respected the city council's wishes to put the gun away. Know what you are talking about from know on. Learn to read. " I wonder what class that poster took LOL

army74 · « **Reply #33 on:** May 23, 2010, 03:36:07 PM »

Detroitbiker I think he or she went to CCW or CPL for dummies lol

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Author Topic: Update on My situation with the PPD (Read 27518 times)

stainless1911

stainless1911

stainless1911

stainless1911

stainless1911