Author Topic: Walking stop... (Read 25317 times)

Advanced Security · « **on:** July 18, 2010, 09:38:24 PM »

OCing in flint for me seems to attract police.

I went for a 45 min walk around my neighborhood with my wife tonight. As we were arriving home, 6 police cars sped down my road towards me. Before I went in the house, I went to greet the officer. He demands my CPL, I inform him I don't have to give him one, he says yes, I eventually do, he whines that I need to conceal. I explain visual deterant, etc, he whines some more, as his buddy reaches for my gun to disarm me. They proceed to insist that I have no choice but to comply, and identify. I'm not 100% sure what the law is or isn't, but neither were any of them, so none of us pushed real hard.

So, what is the law? In a case where people call, am I obligated to identify? 3 of the 6 were real rude, the other three were real nice...no recording of the convo, my bad...that won't happen again...

Jeff

autosurgeon · « **Reply #1 on:** July 18, 2010, 09:40:24 PM »

You need to spend more time in the OC questions section... Read ALL the stickies. Watch ALL the videos.

emt805 · « **Reply #2 on:** July 18, 2010, 10:37:35 PM »

Quote from: Advanced Security on July 18, 2010, 09:38:24 PM

his buddy reaches for my gun to disarm me

Bad choice on his part. You reach for it I see you as going to use it against me. If you would have reached for his gun he and his buddys would have put a hurt on you. I would of held my ground, not shown cpl as you are oc nor would I have shown id as I was not brandishing nor am I commiting a crime for him to stop and hold me. I would have informed them to get a supervisor on scene to see how that went. Just speaking for myself.

wardog6t · « **Reply #3 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:04:23 PM »

Video? Audio? Recorder?

wardog6t · « **Reply #4 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:10:10 PM »

Lately LEO's have been using the a new tactic of "Are you a Felon" to get you to provide ID. Then once you don't provide ID the LEO can say he had reasonable suspicion to detain you and further exploit your weakness of not fully understanding the law.

autosurgeon · « **Reply #5 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:10:33 PM »

Quote from: wardog6t on July 18, 2010, 11:04:23 PM

Video? Audio? Recorder?

He stated he has none...

wardog6t · « **Reply #6 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:16:27 PM »

Yes I was looking for WHY he didnt have them?

Quote from: autosurgeon on July 18, 2010, 11:10:33 PM

Quote from: wardog6t on July 18, 2010, 11:04:23 PM
Video? Audio? Recorder?

He stated he has none...

Advanced Security · « **Reply #7 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:29:15 PM »

Quote from: wardog6t on July 18, 2010, 11:10:10 PM

Lately LEO's have been using the a new tactic of "Are you a Felon" to get you to provide ID. Then once you don't provide ID the LEO can say he had reasonable suspicion to detain you and further exploit your weakness of not fully understanding the law.

So what to do in this case? Ask for a suprivisor? How do I handle that? I've read the stuff in OC questions, watched the videos, am I correct in assuming even though they had someone call on me, I could stand and not co-operate with requests for id and everything?

Jeff

wardog6t · « **Reply #8 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:31:15 PM »

DO NOT PROVIDE ID? You can verbally tell them your information. Always have video/audio recording device when OC.

emt805 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:32:36 PM »

Quote from: Advanced Security on July 18, 2010, 11:29:15 PM

Quote from: wardog6t on July 18, 2010, 11:10:10 PM
Lately LEO's have been using the a new tactic of "Are you a Felon" to get you to provide ID. Then once you don't provide ID the LEO can say he had reasonable suspicion to detain you and further exploit your weakness of not fully understanding the law.

What I would do if it was me would be to pull out the cpl and allow them to see the photo and keep all my info covered.

wardog6t · « **Reply #10 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:34:12 PM »

When you are OCing you do not have to provide your CPL or DL Period.

wardog6t · « **Reply #11 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:35:33 PM »

Only when you are placed under arrest, you must provide identification. "Cant cite it."

wardog6t · « **Reply #12 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:36:44 PM »

Your identification is almost like drugs. "Just say NO"!

wardog6t · « **Reply #13 on:** July 18, 2010, 11:39:32 PM »

ALWAYS have a video/audio device. I cannot stress this enough. Even when you are CCing. For various reasons always have something with you. If you are about to be detained turn it on, have a freind, wife or just leave it on the dash. Whatever record everything.

JoeCar · « **Reply #14 on:** July 19, 2010, 12:34:56 AM »

I'm interested in what the writing below Infidel says. Nice pic of the back of your head.

mosnar87 · « **Reply #15 on:** July 19, 2010, 01:27:40 AM »

According to the URL, this image comes from a site called "RankMyTattoos" so it may or may not be an image of wardog6t.

If it is, great! But one shouldn't assume that an avatar is always the person behind the keyboard.

Just my 2 cents.

wardog6t · « **Reply #16 on:** July 19, 2010, 01:33:10 AM »

Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner!

Bronson · « **Reply #17 on:** July 19, 2010, 02:21:10 AM »

Quote from: Advanced Security on July 18, 2010, 09:38:24 PM

They proceed to insist that I have no choice but to comply, and identify.

28.425f

Quote

28.425f Concealed pistol license; possession; disclosure to police officer; violation; penalty; seizure; forfeiture; "peace officer" defined.
Sec. 5f.

(1) An individual who is licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol shall have his or her license to carry that pistol in his or her possession at all times he or she is carrying a concealed pistol.

(2) An individual who is licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol and who is carrying a concealed pistol shall show both of the following to a peace officer upon request by that peace officer:

(a) His or her license to carry a concealed pistol.

(b) His or her driver license or Michigan personal identification card.

(3) An individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol and who is carrying a concealed pistol and who is stopped by a peace officer shall immediately disclose to the peace officer that he or she is carrying a pistol concealed upon his or her person or in his or her vehicle.

If you are not carrying a concealed pistol the ID and disclosure requirement in the concealed carry statute does not apply.

There may be another law and/or court decision that does require ID but if you're OC 28.425f ain't it.

Bronson

ken243 · « **Reply #18 on:** July 19, 2010, 05:34:45 AM »

Advanced secuirty; I am currently deployed in Afghanistan. My first R&R is in Nov. I live in Clio so if you would like to stroll through Flint OC I am game. I have video sunglasses and a belt clip video camera. I can send you some links if you want on where to get them. I figure if I get arrested they will find one camera and erase it but maybe not 2.

FatboyCykes · « **Reply #19 on:** July 19, 2010, 05:56:07 AM »

It's easy to armchair quarterback in these situations. When you have 6(?)cop cars rolling up on you it can get intimidating real quick, specially when/if you're with family and/or friends. They were obviously in the wrong here as you did not have to provide ID, I think you knew this instinctively, but of course there's always pause for concern when the adrenaline is pumping and guns are involved. Chalk this up as a learning experience and prepare better for the next one, as there probably will be one.

wardog6t · « **Reply #20 on:** July 19, 2010, 12:24:36 PM »

Quote from: ken243 on July 19, 2010, 05:34:45 AM

Advanced secuirty; I am currently deployed in Afghanistan. My first R&R is in Nov. I live in Clio so if you would like to stroll through Flint OC I am game. I have video sunglasses and a belt clip video camera. I can send you some links if you want on where to get them. I figure if I get arrested they will find one camera and erase it but maybe not 2.

Just wondering where in Afghan? I have a freind thats an operator for one of the contractors over there. Ya'll might be able to hook up. He is on the poppy seed eridication dealio.

wardog6t · « **Reply #21 on:** July 19, 2010, 12:29:07 PM »

Quote from: FatboyCykes on July 19, 2010, 05:56:07 AM

It's easy to armchair quarterback in these situations. When you have 6(?)cop cars rolling up on you it can get intimidating real quick, specially when/if you're with family and/or friends. They were obviously in the wrong here as you did not have to provide ID, I think you knew this instinctively, but of course there's always pause for concern when the adrenaline is pumping and guns are involved. Chalk this up as a learning experience and prepare better for the next one, as there probably will be one.

Yes I agree especially when your dealing with color of law leo's that feel the world is there's. That being said the bottom line is not to deviate from what you know is the law.

army74 · « **Reply #22 on:** July 19, 2010, 02:26:53 PM »

where did you get video camera sunglasses cause i need a pair here in pontiac

wardog6t · « **Reply #23 on:** July 19, 2010, 03:10:54 PM »

http://spygear.factoryoutletstore.com/?cid=15552&chid=2&OVRAW=video%20sunglasses&OVKEY=video%20sun%20glasses&OVMTC=standard&OVADID=55830849022&OVKWID=267231032522&OVCAMPGID=7151578022&OVADGRPID=12622141410&OVNDID=ND1

Tango125INF11b · « **Reply #24 on:** July 19, 2010, 04:44:41 PM »

I speak/read arabic and his shirt says Kafir. Pronounced Ka-feer. It means non-believer.

Hope that doesn't offend anyone having a Muslim here.

Advanced Security · « **Reply #25 on:** July 19, 2010, 05:03:19 PM »

Quote from: ken243 on July 19, 2010, 05:34:45 AM

Advanced secuirty; I am currently deployed in Afghanistan. My first R&R is in Nov. I live in Clio so if you would like to stroll through Flint OC I am game. I have video sunglasses and a belt clip video camera. I can send you some links if you want on where to get them. I figure if I get arrested they will find one camera and erase it but maybe not 2.

I'd love to hook up when you get back regardless. I'd like to buy you a meal, and say thanks for your service. OC is a given.

God Bless

Jeff

FatboyCykes · « **Reply #26 on:** July 19, 2010, 05:16:18 PM »

Quote from: Tango125INF11b on July 19, 2010, 04:44:41 PM

I speak/read arabic and his shirt says Kafir. Pronounced Ka-feer. It means non-believer. Hope that doesn't offend anyone having a Muslim here.

Muslim!? GTFO of here!!!!!

Seriously though, welcome, here we're all the same religion...2A!

Advanced Security · « **Reply #27 on:** July 19, 2010, 06:16:38 PM »

Quote from: FatboyCykes on July 19, 2010, 05:16:18 PM

Seriously though, welcome, here we're all the same religion...2A!

Classic! Best statement I've heard in a long time.

good job!

Tango125INF11b · « **Reply #28 on:** July 19, 2010, 09:05:23 PM »

I agree FBC. I still go to Mass on Saturday afternoons also. So I guess you could say I am more of an Abrahamic Pluralist than a Muslim. I did two tours to Iraq, so to the guy in Trashcanistan, if its anything like it was when I was in, stay frosty. You need anything to make your life easier let me know. I did 6 years in the service and spent almost 3 years in combat action, so like I said I know what its like having to take "baby wipe showers". If you need ANYTHING. ANYTHING. LMK. Then again I was on a very small combat outpost, for all I know you are on a big ole' FOB.

wardog6t · « **Reply #29 on:** July 19, 2010, 09:20:26 PM »

Quote from: Tango125INF11b on July 19, 2010, 09:05:23 PM

I agree FBC. I still go to Mass on Saturday afternoons also. So I guess you could say I am more of an Abrahamic Pluralist than a Muslim. I did two tours to Iraq, so to the guy in Trashcanistan, if its anything like it was when I was in, stay frosty. You need anything to make your life easier let me know. I did 6 years in the service and spent almost 3 years in combat action, so like I said I know what its like having to take "baby wipe showers". If you need ANYTHING. ANYTHING. LMK. Then again I was on a very small combat outpost, for all I know you are on a big ole' FOB.

LOL OP-9T lots of baby wipe bath's and sand spiced ramon noodles with Jalapeno cheese =mmmm. Got to love it.

ken243 · « **Reply #30 on:** July 21, 2010, 02:12:33 PM »

Wardog; I am currently at Camp Leatherneck. I will be running through Kandahar for R&R other than that no other FOB's for me.

Advanced; Thanks for the offer but to clarify I am a DOD contractor, a Paramedic. Not in the armed forces. The guys in uniform deserve the credit. They are paying me very well for the job I do.

As far as the sunglasses here is the link.
http://www.brickhousesecurity.com/spy-camera-sunglasses.html?googlebase&zmam=85491576&zmas=1&zmac=2&zmap=007-DVR260

They look a lot like oakley's so that may provide some "camo"

wardog6t · « **Reply #31 on:** July 21, 2010, 07:48:24 PM »

Quote from: ken243 on July 21, 2010, 02:12:33 PM

Wardog; I am currently at Camp Leatherneck. I will be running through Kandahar for R&R other than that no other FOB's for me.

Advanced; Thanks for the offer but to clarify I am a DOD contractor, a Paramedic. Not in the armed forces. The guys in uniform deserve the credit. They are paying me very well for the job I do.

My freind is also a medic for a DOD contractor. He's in Kabul. Ya'll probably work for the same company maybe even with each other. His first name is Josh.

Tango125INF11b · « **Reply #32 on:** July 21, 2010, 09:55:23 PM »

I worked with A LOT of contractors in Al Habbaniya, Iraq. Mostly American (BWinc) and South African contractors but also some British. Contracting is the way to go. Did the same job I did for 8 times the pay. Some of the NSW guys that we worked with were adamant on getting a bunch of us to contract out for the money with themso they had people they knew.

Bronson · « **Reply #33 on:** July 21, 2010, 10:21:25 PM »

Our company just lost several good aircraft mechanics, avionics techs, and airframe structures guys to the overseas contract gig. I'm kinda wishing I had some skills they needed but, alas, I doubt they need people to refurbish the jet interiors and make 'em all fancy.

Bronson

lil_freak_66 · « **Reply #34 on:** July 22, 2010, 12:54:38 PM »

i know a former military aircraft mechanic who's looking for work,that company still looking for people?

ken243 · « **Reply #35 on:** July 22, 2010, 11:39:53 PM »

lil_freak- Yes I think they are looking for people. The company is Dyncorp. If he goes to their website he can search for jobs there. Pay on average for each job is approx. 2.5 to 4 years of pay you would make in the US for a year here, tax free.

News:

Author Topic: Walking stop... (Read 25317 times)