Stupid open carry - Ann Arbor Art Fair

[stiofan]

"Stupid" is actually too mild a word for what I observed at the Ann Arbor Art Fair yesterday. I was photographing a student protest involving people upset by the latest war between Israel and the Palestinians. The demonstrators were marching through the crowded streets adjacent to the UM campus where the tents of the artists and vendors were set up. I was up close to the head of the march and I see a tall young guy who was standing there having positioned himself to block the marchers and giving everybody the finger (both hands). Oh yeah, he was carrying his automatic in a drop holster.

WTF? You can imagine the scene of all these college kids yelling and chanting about the  the latest Middle East conflict. I am not sure what this idiot was trying to accomplish but the potential for provoking a screaming, in your face confrontation was certainly there and then what? As it was the march organizers keep their people disciplined and the march continued. I was the one yelling at this guy and what I said, repeatedly, was that he was a disgrace to the open carry movement.

I have never seen such reckless behavior at a demonstration. If you were that young man trying to start a fight with a crowd of angry Arab protestors, while carrying, I strongly encourage to reflect on your reckless behavior and your poor judgement.

[autosurgeon]

Why is it my bs meter is on full power... Oh yeah because no pictures of this.

[TucTom]

I really want to see a pic of the "automatic" in his drop holster.

Ryan, I would think you are more familiar than I am, which automatic transmission fits in a holster?

[doesch]

I'm calling BS because I've gone to this event it's during the summer and there really are not many college kids around.

[Ezerharden]

what "automatic" fits in a holster?

[CV67PAT]

"Stupid" is actually too mild a word for what I observed at the Ann Arbor Art Fair yesterday. I was photographing a student protest...

But I didn't take any pictures.

[Golden Eagle]

But I didn't take any pictures.

He was busy ...

I was the one yelling at this guy...

[gryphon]

I was photographing a student protest involving people upset by the latest war between Israel and the Palestinians.

Pics, please. 

[gryphon]

what "automatic" fits in a holster?

Glock 18, HK VP70M, Beretta 93R...

[TheQ]

what "automatic" fits in a holster?

Glock 18

[stiofan]

"Why is it my bs meter is on full power... Oh yeah because no pictures of this."

You weren't there and I was. You can speculate all you want about what you consider bs but this wasn't, and no I didn't start taking pictures of this kid I was standing right next to. I was so close they would have all been blurred out anyway and as my gear is as old as I am, no I don;t have a "macro mode." You wan't to see the other pics of kids demonstrating and people screaming at them, I have plenty and will send you as many as you want. I have no other motivation in posting this other than as a cautionary tale for individuals lawfully committed to the intelligent exercise of our rights as Michigan citizens.

[stiofan]

" ...which automatic transmission fits in a holster?"

"Automatic" is the old school term for semi-auto pistols. Remember? It was what everybody called them at one time and if that pre-dates you then you just learned a new vocabulary word.

[TheQ]

" ...which automatic transmission fits in a holster?"

"Automatic" is the old school term for semi-auto pistols. Remember? It was what everybody called them at one time and if that pre-dates you then you just learned a new vocabulary word.

Ummmm. Automatics are not semi-autos. Calling them such just shows ignorance.

[TheQ]

All, FWIW, the OP is registered with a Eastern Michigan University email address *shrugs*

[stiofan]

I'm calling BS because I've gone to this event it's during the summer and there really are not many college kids around.

There are always some students around in Ann Arbor during the summer but you are right that they are a lot fewer at Art Fair time. This was different in that Arab students from several of the surrounding colleges decided to have a protest here over the war in Gaza.

[stiofan]

All, FWIW, the OP is registered with a Eastern Michigan University email address *shrugs*

That is correct that is where I take classes. Not everyone can afford to go to UM

[stiofan]

Ummmm. Automatics are not semi-autos. Calling them such just shows ignorance.

No it does not show ignorance, just a different experience that predates yours. Pistols were called "automatics" at one time because they "automatically" loaded the next round. What is more, quite a few top break revolvers were also described as "automatics" because they automatically ejected the shell casings when they were opened. By all means call them whatever you wan but the term "automatic" was applied to semi-auto pistols for decades and that is what I call them still.

[bigt8261]

No it does not show ignorance, just a different experience that predates yours. Pistols were called "automatics" at one time because they "automatically" loaded the next round. What is more, quite a few top break revolvers were also described as "automatics" because they automatically ejected the shell casings when they were opened. By all means call them whatever you wan but the term "automatic" was applied to semi-auto pistols for decades and that is what I call them still.

This is true. My mother-in-law has an Iver Johnson Safety Automatic from the 20's. You could keep the hammer down on a live round and the brass would automatically pop out when you opened the action.

[Raggs]

"The History of the 1911 Pistol The Model 1911 .45 Automatic Pistol is the world’s most respected handgun, and has been designated by many authorities as the finest service pistol design of all time."
from http://www.browning.com/library/infonews/detail.asp?ID=301
So it does appear that the term automatic pistol is not necessarily wrong.

[FASBOLD]

I remember as a kid everyone calling 1911's a ".45 Automatic", even though they are actually semi-automatic.

[TucTom]

"I was up close to the head of the march and I see a tall young guy who was standing there having positioned himself to block the marchers and giving everybody the finger (both hands). Oh yeah, he was carrying his automatic in a drop holster.
" and then "You can speculate all you want about what you consider bs but this wasn't, and no I didn't start taking pictures of this kid I was standing right next to. "

So, I will ask this of you. Which above statement is true?

[gryphon]

Arab students from several of the surrounding colleges decided to have a protest here over the war in Gaza.

Is U of M bombing the Palestinians?  I'm confused.

[Shadow Bear]

What war in Gaza? Are we talking about the dumbasses who keep lobbing rockets at the Jews? Did they expect to provoke Israel with impunity? I think not.

Lets not have any crap about 'it's only a few Hamas that are the trouble makers'- the rest of the residents of Gaza could stop them, if they REALLY felt that Hamas was not representing them. Instead, they offer themselves as human shields to protect the rockets.

I support Israel bombing Gaza back to the Stoneage.

[stiofan]

"I was up close to the head of the march and I see a tall young guy who was standing there having positioned himself to block the marchers and giving everybody the finger (both hands). Oh yeah, he was carrying his automatic in a drop holster.
" and then "You can speculate all you want about what you consider bs but this wasn't, and no I didn't start taking pictures of this kid I was standing right next to. "

So, I will ask this of you. Which above statement is true?

Ummmm. Automatics are not semi-autos. Calling them such just shows ignorance.

Both statements are true. I was at the very front of the march and when he stood in front to block it I was standing right next to him. Simple huh.

[stiofan]

What war in Gaza? Are we talking about the dumbasses who keep lobbing rockets at the Jews? ....I support Israel bombing Gaza back to the Stoneage.

Check the news and you'll see that the dumbassess got shelled and bombed for ten days and then the Israeli Army crossed the border in force where they remain as of right now. In my neck of the woods that is what is called a "war.'

[Jeff]

I have heard them referred to as "automatics" in several GOOD movies from the 80's.

[gryphon]

On the off chance stiofan was telling the truth, I decided to read all the news reports I could from the rally.  I read mlive, coverage from an Arabic site, coverage from the University of Michigan (umich), and more.  I watched video and saw dozens of photographs.  In not one story or news report or photograph or video did I see any counter-protester blocking the way, much less an open carrier holding up his or her middle fingers.

In fact, the University of Michigan mentioned a lot of actions of people against the rally.  Drivers honked their horns and yelled at the pro-Palestinian protesters, and the people who traveled and bought tables at the art fair complained about the pro-Palestinian protesters who were disrupting their activities.  But the ultra-liberal UofM didn't once mention an open carrier or anyone who blocked the path of the march.

[stiofan]

In not one story or news report or photograph or video did I see any counter-protester blocking the way, much less an open carrier holding up his or her middle fingers....But the ultra-liberal UofM didn't once mention an open carrier or anyone who blocked the path of the march."

I didn't see any reporters or news photographers at the very front of the march on State Street where this incident happened and in fact I only saw one news photographers at the rally later in front of the Grad library. There were also no cops except for one officer who stopped the march briefly to tell them to quit using their bullhorn or he would start making arrests. The kids quit using it and the cop split.

The whole incident with the OC guy was over very quickly and luckily he was not shouting or saying anything - just giving the the double "f*** you." As just one guy he wasn't going to stop anything and by being planted right in the middle of the route of march, all he was going to do was get enveloped quickly, which he was. I was so close to him I didn't even see he was carrying at first because I was standing on his left side and didn't anything other than the middle fingers he was waving round until I moved to the edge of protestors-to my left and wound up on his right when i saw his automatic in a drop holster.

Of course if this is all just liberal conspiracy to discredit the OC movement - please consider the following. I didn't go find a cop or send an email to newspaper or post this on face book or call up Rachel Maddow. This is the only place I have posted because while I don't OC, I strongly support the right of Michigan citizens to fully exercise their rights under the law. My impression until yesterday was that people who did OC were universally the most responsible and thoughtful gun owners who were hyper aware of their responsibilities. I reported here what I witnessed because I honestly hoped that this young man might be a reader and respond as to just what he thought he was doing.

If people here belief that it is impossible that someone exercising their right to carry would act in such a manner than I have bad news for you. It happened and I saw it. As he left the march and once he was out of the crowd of protestors I did yell at them that he was a disgrace to the open carry movement because he was. If you want to disagree with that proposition I would like to hear your reasons.

[TheQ]

I'm done with this thread.