Test new OC locations with disposable gun?

[CitizensHaveRights]

Is it at all probable to be arrested/confiscated (by the Grand Rapids Gestapo, for example) for simply walking about town, visiting the library, etc?

Or has every cop in the state already been properly desensitized?

If you do lose your pistol to a cop, how many months does it take to get it back?

The reason why I ask is I'm wondering if it would be prudent to have a very cheap pistol, say a Hi-Point, in the holster in case I run into a truly badge heavy idiot. (or a lying librarian who tells the cops I brandished)

[TucTom]

What the Flip kind of questions are those? Before you post your first post, read the forums you may see a lot of questions already answered. Why would you "carry" a "cheap pistol"? Are you already looking to get arrested???

[TheQ]

Anything is possible and there is no shortage of cases where the local criminal gang ....errrr, police department (or Sheriff, or MSP) have hassled OCers, detained them, arrested them, or confiscated their property.

That being said, these are the vast minority of cases. I would guess 99% of OCers have no encounters of any significance in a given year.

We try to work closely with law enforcement to educate them. In fact, one of our BoD members is a LEO.

[CitizensHaveRights]

Why would you "carry" a "cheap pistol"?

To test the response of the indigenous LEO population.
If they fail the test, I don't want them walking away with my favorite 1911 in an evidence bag.
I'd like some idea of the odds. I suspect it's a long shot like 100:1 by now, but would like to know in advance if I'm overestimating LEO education.

The first thing I'd do is test to see if Charlotte librarians and police are compliant with the results of the CADL suit.

BTW, what's wrong with carrying a cheap pistol?
I'm talking about something totally functional, like a  Hi-Point .45ACP, not a mechanized joke like a Raven .25ACP.
The only thing I see functionally wrong with carrying a Hi-Point is the possible awkwardness of drawing a gun with a slide the size and shape of a brick.

Are you already looking to get arrested???

Not looking forward to it, but I can't control the actions of others, especially those who believe their badge confers omnipotence.
I'd rather be arrested for OC than refuse to OC out of fear of possible unlawful arrest.

A right you're afraid to exercise is a right that you voluntarily relinquish.

Q posted while I was typing the above.
Sounds like his estimate of the odds is similar to mine.

[TheQ]

Why carry a 1911? A true 1911 only has 7(?) rounds as it is single stack. Why limit yourself like that?

[CitizensHaveRights]

In short,  I'd carry what I own.

I like 1911s. Nothing wrong with a Glock or M&P, but trying to stick me with one is like trying to sell a AR to somebody who likes walnut stocked Pre-64 Winchester 70s.

A GI mag allows for 7+1. Two 230gr JHPs per customer. (one hit on a subject and two on bystanders per 17rd Glockload is NYPD standards, not mine)

If there are more than four of them there's a good chance #5 is going to have time to do something to you while you're dealing with the first four no matter how much firepower you have.

Most 1911s not striving for GI authenticity come with 8 rd mags. Every single stack I've owned did, even the 3" carry guns.
You can always load 8+1 and carry a 10rd spare. 19rd of 230gr HP goes a long way.

Besides, how do you know 'my favorite 1911' isn't THIS? (BTW, that is a screaming steal on a gun that lists for $1449)

[SD40VE]

Why carry a 1911? A true 1911 only has 7(?) rounds as it is single stack. Why limit yourself like that?

.45 ACP because shooting twice is silly lol.

1911 is a timeless classic, that being said i like mt 14+1 in .40 S&W over 7+! in .45acp

[Xpiatio]

My biggest stink here is the fact that you want to "test" the police and librarians.  That is just a horrible mindset to have for open carry. 

[CitizensHaveRights]

Benjamin, I don't see what's wrong with checking up on my employees.

If they obey the law, then fine, I can rest easy.
If they insist on violating state law, then corrective action is needed. 

[part deux]

How about just going about your life and doing what you normally do?

[CitizensHaveRights]

Going to the library, reading a magazine, and borrowing a couple of books is one of the things I normally do.

It's just after the much publicized assault with a deadly and perjury in GR last year (still a year away from federal court trial for civil rights violations) and this year's conclusion of CADL v MOC, a little voice in the back of my head was whispering "do you want a throwaway gun for that?" (After the video from Calumet county posted here this afternoon, the little voice is starting to shout)

[part deux]

Going to the library, reading a magazine, and borrowing a couple of books is one of the things I normally do.

It's just after the much publicized assault with a deadly and perjury in GR last year (still a year away from federal court trial for civil rights violations) and this year's conclusion of CADL v MOC, a little voice in the back of my head was whispering "do you want a throwaway gun for that?" (After the video from Calumet county posted here this afternoon, the little voice is starting to shout)

A really smart person has suggested that unless you have bail money and sufficient resources to hire an attorney, then maybe you shouldn't be open carrying.

[CitizensHaveRights]

A really smart person has suggested that unless you have bail money and sufficient resources to hire an attorney, then maybe you shouldn't be open carrying.

Fortunately, that doesn't have anything to do with me.
My point in this discussion might be made with an analogy:
If you suspected the local LEOs were planning to arrest you on false charges of solicitation and seize your vehicle, would you keep driving the Corvette you intend to leave to your grandchildren some day, or would you park it and drive your "winter car" for a while?

Also I'm apparently trying to come up with an excuse to buy a Hi-Point to play with even though I'll probably give it away or sell it in a few months. I read some reports last weekend that they are surprisingly accurate and reliable, and suddenly I'm feeling guilty over looking down my nose at my young nephew's pride and joy (a Haskell .45) twenty years ago and feel like I need to make amends. (I did shoot it when offered, all i can remember is that I pulled the trigger twice and it went bang twice. I don't know if I was more surprised that it worked or that it had an acceptable trigger pull. Ugliest gun I ever held in my hand.) Besides, if I found out I could shoot a Hi-Point really well, it would be kind of funny to take it to a CPL class and see what reactions I got.

[Super Trucker]

How old are you?

[CitizensHaveRights]

50, balding, some gray hair, beard totally gray if I let it grow.
Not the sort that looks threatening at all.

[TucTom]

50, balding, some gray hair, beard totally gray if I let it grow.
Not the sort that looks threatening at all.

But it sounds like you are going to put off a "I'm going to test you" vibe anyway. It doesn't matter if you "look threatening" or not. It is the body language that people will see.

[SD40VE]

Fortunately, that doesn't have anything to do with me.
My point in this discussion might be made with an analogy:
If you suspected the local LEOs were planning to arrest you on false charges of solicitation and seize your vehicle, would you keep driving the Corvette you intend to leave to your grandchildren some day, or would you park it and drive your "winter car" for a while?

Also I'm apparently trying to come up with an excuse to buy a Hi-Point to play with even though I'll probably give it away or sell it in a few months. I read some reports last weekend that they are surprisingly accurate and reliable, and suddenly I'm feeling guilty over looking down my nose at my young nephew's pride and joy (a Haskell .45) twenty years ago and feel like I need to make amends. (I did shoot it when offered, all i can remember is that I pulled the trigger twice and it went bang twice. I don't know if I was more surprised that it worked or that it had an acceptable trigger pull. Ugliest gun I ever held in my hand.) Besides, if I found out I could shoot a Hi-Point really well, it would be kind of funny to take it to a CPL class and see what reactions I got.

MY woman took her cpl class with her hipoint c9 and shot just as well as me to be top of class in accuracy. nice tight groupings. they are good, ugly, reliable, accurate guns

i find recoild isnt bad at all probably due to the massive slide on it. its fairly top heavy

[CitizensHaveRights]

But it sounds like you are going to put off a "I'm going to test you" vibe anyway.

What the Flip kind of statement is that?

[TucTom]

You forgot the rest of my statement. I quoted your statement about you not looking threatening.

But you also clearly have said you want to "test" Police and Librarians. So you seem to me to be a person who wants to put off that vibe.

[gryphon]

But you also clearly have said you want to "test" Police and Librarians. So you seem to me to be a person who wants to put off that vibe.

To be fair, MOC members individually and collectively do this exact thing on occasion.

[TucTom]

MOC members .

Thanks for pointing that out Dan. I see I never got a renewal this year and I will be renewing now. Oops looks like renewing tomorrow.

[CitizensHaveRights]

But you also clearly have said you want to "test" Police and Librarians. So you seem to me to be a person who wants to put off that vibe.

You're reading way too much into this.
It appears you made some assumptions from my original post, and by now those assumptions are set in your mind like concrete. (standard human brain function, it takes much more data to override a belief than it did to form the belief in the first place)

I just want to know how library staff and CPD react, assuming they even notice. The easy chairs in the periodical area offer concealment to the side and rear, and the checkout counter is higher than my navel, so it's entirely possible staffers won't even know.

The current librarian has been around for about ten years but I've never met him, he seems to avoid patron contact. I think I know how his predecessor would have reacted, Luanne would have had kittens (imagine a straight laced old woman who's witnessed something utterly disgraceful) , but if she'd gotten the word about CADL v MOC through the library association the most she'd ever do is glare at me. 

Really I'm more interested in CPD's response, but it seems likely they'll never know unless a fellow patron decides to dial 9-1-1. I suspect if I go once a week for the rest of the month there's a 30-50% chance of that happening. Charlotte does seem to have its share of NIMBYs and mother hens.

[TucTom]

Yes based on what you wrote now I can clearly see that I indeed read your very 1st post here too deeply. I have no problem with a person who carries a Hi Point.

I hope you understand where I am coming from too. Being that I am not a fan of people who will go out of their way to attract attention. Do they have the right? Yes of course. Will I support someone who does nothing legally wrong? Yes I will. Do I like people who tend to do this (of which you don't see too often anymore) not really.

But you still seem to want to carry because "I just want to know how library staff and CPD react". Instead of I carry and I went to the library and nothing happened. Do you see my point? So, my assumptions are based on what you continue to write.

But good luck and I hope it all goes okay.

[gryphon]

I have no problem with a person who carries a Hi Point.

See, this is the problem we have in America.  People keep saying we need a discussion about mental illness in this country, yet nobody ever does anything.  

[TucTom]

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!

[SD40VE]

i was actually debating picking up a hi point .45 they have at my LGS. used for $110 lol

[Smashfacekrav]

See, this is the problem we have in America.  People keep saying we need a discussion about mental illness in this country, yet nobody ever does anything.  

We can start with this thread. Now have a seat on my couch and tell me the names of your guns.


Open carry, Open minds