Author Topic: SB 1028 - Parking Lots  (Read 9045 times)

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Offline jgillmanjr

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SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« on: September 10, 2014, 08:37:03 AM »
You private property rights hating cats will like this

http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?2014-SB-1028

Congrats, your new parking lot bill.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2014, 08:43:24 AM by bigt8261 »
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Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2014, 09:30:16 AM »
The contents of my car trunk are my private property.
That's why they need a search warrant to see inside it.
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline jgillmanjr

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2014, 09:44:05 AM »
The contents of my car trunk are my private property.
That's why they need a search warrant to see inside it.

Your car is parked on their private property. They can dictate whatever conditions they want for having said car parked on their property.

Ergo, they don't need $#|t to see inside if that's one of their conditions.
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Offline gryphon

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2014, 09:54:53 AM »
I am 100% for SB 1028!  Many states have this law.  It's about time Michigan provided for people to be armed going to and from their places of employment without fear of getting fired.

And no, one cannot always park off company property.  At least safely.  I don't think an employer prohibiting an employee from keeping a Bible in his car would fly legally.

Offline jgillmanjr

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2014, 10:05:48 AM »
It's about time Michigan provided for people to force conditions upon their employer by the heavy hand of government.

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Offline gryphon

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2014, 10:32:22 AM »
That's a simplistic view. Taking it to its natural conclusion, I can only assume you are similarly against employers having to follow safety laws and NFPA. This bill is not onerous and places no undue burden on business.

Offline jgillmanjr

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2014, 11:46:11 AM »
That's a simplistic view. Taking it to its natural conclusion, I can only assume you are similarly against employers having to follow safety laws and NFPA. This bill is not onerous and places no undue burden on business.

I am against anyone being forced to comply with arbitrary laws or regulations - so yes, your conclusion is correct.

Now to be sure, I'm not arguing that business should not develop and implement their own safety procedures/standards, nor do I believe they should punish employees for following their own legitimate safety procedures. If I owned my own business, I certainly would NOT prohibit employees or customers from carrying firearms on the premise (hell, I'd encourage it). With that said, let the market decide what works.

If an employee doesn't like a policy, they are free to find work elsewhere.
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Offline 32_d3gr33s

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2014, 12:06:24 PM »

If an employee doesn't like a policy, they are free to find work elsewhere.

you think so?  Find me a job that pays 60+k a year with no experience, no degree, and the best insurance ive had at any job i've worked at, just so i can store my cc in my car while im working.  It must be local though because i will not force my wife to quit her job, nor will i pull my kids out of school when they are only a few years away from graduating.  I will gladly switch careers if you can...
I could write something cliché and insightful, but that would be too cliché and insightful.

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Offline jgillmanjr

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2014, 12:52:37 PM »
you think so?  Find me a job that pays 60+k a year with no experience, no degree, and the best insurance ive had at any job i've worked at, just so i can store my cc in my car while im working.  It must be local though because i will not force my wife to quit her job, nor will i pull my kids out of school when they are only a few years away from graduating.  I will gladly switch careers if you can...

Don't want to leave your existing company because you like what you have? Then don't.

However, don't advocate the use of the strong arm of government to force your preferences on a business either.
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Offline TheQ

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2014, 01:33:49 PM »
A Senate democrat (the whip) -- I haven't read the bill yet, but this CAN'T be good.
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Offline TheQ

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2014, 01:35:53 PM »

A Senate democrat (the whip) -- I haven't read the bill yet, but this CAN'T be good.

I just read the bill. I'm very surprised by it -- but I still oppose it on private property principles.
I Am Not A Lawyer (nor a gunsmith).

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2014, 01:41:58 PM »
Don't want to leave your existing company because you like what you have? Then don't.

However, don't advocate the use of the strong arm of government to force your preferences on a business either.

When those 'preferences' involve your natural right to self defense for the majority of the time you spend in your car, a right specifically protected by the Constitution?
This is more important than many other things government shoves down employers' throats, like mandatory break times and height of stair railings.
What if your place of employment doesn't like black skin, or Catholic Church members? Do they have a property right to post their parking lot against Negroes and Papists?
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline 32_d3gr33s

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2014, 02:03:29 PM »
based on the fact that most here boycott PRIVATE businesses that ban guns on their PRIVATE property, i  think it's kind of hypocritical...  You refuse to patronize places that do not allow you to carry, but still continue to buy the products of companies that dont allow their own employees to carry, let alone store their handgun in their car.   Im all for the rights of Private Property owners, but there needs to be a line.  The state gave me a license to carry a firearm to protect me and my family, i should be able to store it in my vehicle.  I think that if companies can ban guns from their property, so can private business owners.  By entering their place of business, you agree to their rules, one of which may be that if they suspect you of having a weapon in your car, they should be able to search it.  Sounds fair right?  you dont have to shop there... 
I could write something cliché and insightful, but that would be too cliché and insightful.

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Offline TheQ

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2014, 02:59:29 PM »

based on the fact that most here boycott PRIVATE businesses that ban guns on their PRIVATE property, i  think it's kind of hypocritical...  You refuse to patronize places that do not allow you to carry, but still continue to buy the products of companies that dont allow their own employees to carry, let alone store their handgun in their car.   Im all for the rights of Private Property owners, but there needs to be a line.  The state gave me a license to carry a firearm to protect me and my family, i should be able to store it in my vehicle.  I think that if companies can ban guns from their property, so can private business owners.  By entering their place of business, you agree to their rules, one of which may be that if they suspect you of having a weapon in your car, they should be able to search it.  Sounds fair right?  you dont have to shop there...

This is a wonderful idea. Let's compile a list of companies that don't allow employees to keep their guns in their car and protest/boycott them -- one at a time!
I Am Not A Lawyer (nor a gunsmith).

Offline jgillmanjr

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2014, 05:36:48 PM »
When those 'preferences' involve your natural right to self defense for the majority of the time you spend in your car, a right specifically protected by the Constitution?
The Constitution does not apply to private entities - only the government.

Quote
This is more important than many other things government shoves down employers' throats, like mandatory break times and height of stair railings.
Even if it is important, it's still getting shoved down the throat of private property owners.

Quote
What if your place of employment doesn't like black skin, or Catholic Church members? Do they have a property right to post their parking lot against Negroes and Papists?
I would argue they have a moral right to participate in such idiotic behavior.
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Offline jgillmanjr

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #15 on: September 10, 2014, 05:41:23 PM »
based on the fact that most here boycott PRIVATE businesses that ban guns on their PRIVATE property, i  think it's kind of hypocritical...  You refuse to patronize places that do not allow you to carry, but still continue to buy the products of companies that dont allow their own employees to carry, let alone store their handgun in their car.

Like Phil said, sounds like he should start the boycotts.

Quote
   Im all for the rights of Private Property owners, but there needs to be a line.

Where have I heard that before...

Oh!

"I'm all for the 2nd Amendment, but..."

Quote
The state gave me a license to carry a firearm to protect me and my family, i should be able to store it in my vehicle.
So the state can dole out licenses which abrogate private property rights?

Quote
I think that if companies can ban guns from their property, so can private business owners.  By entering their place of business, you agree to their rules, one of which may be that if they suspect you of having a weapon in your car, they should be able to search it.  Sounds fair right?  you dont have to shop there...
Hey, now you're getting it.

First correct thing you've said on this thread.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 07:11:08 AM by jgillmanjr »
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Offline 32_d3gr33s

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #16 on: September 10, 2014, 05:50:17 PM »
You guys start boycotting.  I'll follow once you do...   

Let's start with my company. They supply dairy products to all of the main pizza food chains other than jets.  Dairy products to Hershey, Mars, and numerous other smaller candy company's, dairy product to most of the main frozen food companies such as hot pockets and pizza. 2 of the biggest infant formula company's.   And probably 100 other well known companies.

While we are at it, my wife's company supply's automotive parts to 80% of the cars in the us.

So sell your cars and stop eating dairy.  You do it maybe I will 
I could write something cliché and insightful, but that would be too cliché and insightful.

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Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2014, 09:31:10 AM »
Hey 32, it's not too hard to boycott the pizzeria cheese. Virtually all the pizza chains forbid their drivers to defend themselves, with or without guns.
Do you guys make the 8lb mozzarella bricks I buy at Gordon's Food Supply?

At least we can't accuse    jgillmanjr of being a hypocrite. "It's my land and I'll do what I want" applies equally to all situations as near as I can tell. 
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline 32_d3gr33s

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2014, 10:05:48 AM »
Hey 32, it's not too hard to boycott the pizzeria cheese. Virtually all the pizza chains forbid their drivers to defend themselves, with or without guns.
Do you guys make the 8lb mozzarella bricks I buy at Gordon's Food Supply?

At least we can't accuse    jgillmanjr of being a hypocrite. "It's my land and I'll do what I want" applies equally to all situations as near as I can tell.

I agree that it's not too hard to boycott certain companies. But after some research, I eat at least 1 product my company makes ingredients for every day. Basically, I produce a product much like flour, which is in nearly everything. I, for one, will not boycott food anytime soon.  As for the brick of cheese, it's very likely it comes from us. Most of our cheese is not branded, and bought by other companies and sold under there brand.  GFS is a rather large customer of ours.
I could write something cliché and insightful, but that would be too cliché and insightful.

I shoot first... its better to give than to receive

Offline jgillmanjr

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Re: SB 1028 - Parking Lots
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2014, 11:05:20 AM »
"It's my land and I'll do what I want" applies equally to all situations as near as I can tell.

^^ that
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