Author Topic: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition  (Read 3992 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline linux203

  • MOC Member
  • *
  • Posts: 706
  • First Name (Displayed): Daniel
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2015, 01:59:22 PM »
If it goes to the courts, it will not be pretty for the BATFE. They had their butts chewed by a judge for the definition of deflagrate vs explosion. They lost because they presented no scientific testimony supporting their rule promulgation. Similarly, they will need to present evidence that the chemical composition of M855 meets the statutory definition. This means weighing the jacket, steel, and lead. Then attempting to argue that there are only trace amounts of lead.
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline gryphon

  • MOC Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3942
  • First Name (Displayed): Dan
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #21 on: March 10, 2015, 02:23:58 PM »
*** BREAKING NEWS ***

SS109/M855 ban off the table for now!

NOTICE TO THOSE COMMENTING ON THE ARMOR PIERCING AMMUNITION EXEMPTION FRAMEWORK

Thank you for your interest in ATF’s proposed framework for determining whether certain projectiles are “primarily intended for sporting purposes” within the meaning of 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(17)(C). The informal comment period will close on Monday, March 16, 2015. ATF has already received more than 80,000 comments, which will be made publicly available as soon as practicable.

Although ATF endeavored to create a proposal that reflected a good faith interpretation of the law and balanced the interests of law enforcement, industry, and sportsmen, the vast majority of the comments received to date are critical of the framework, and include issues that deserve further study. Accordingly, ATF will not at this time seek to issue a final framework. After the close of the comment period, ATF will process the comments received, further evaluate the issues raised therein, and provide additional open and transparent process (for example, through additional proposals and opportunities for comment) before proceeding with any framework.

http://www.atf.gov/press/releases/2015-03-021015-advisory-notice-those-commenting-armor-piercing-ammunition-exemption-framework.html

Offline linux203

  • MOC Member
  • *
  • Posts: 706
  • First Name (Displayed): Daniel
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #22 on: March 10, 2015, 04:33:07 PM »
Now... if people can stop panic buying, I need the price of M193 to come down before a Carbine class in August....  ;D
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline gryphon

  • MOC Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3942
  • First Name (Displayed): Dan
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #23 on: March 10, 2015, 06:34:36 PM »
Has 193 gone up?  It was selling for $290/1,000 rd. not that long ago.  A few of us here stocked up.  Lake City and IMI were both plentiful.  Wow, looking around I see people are buying both 193 and 855.  Some places are sold out of both.

You taking carbine at MDFI?

Offline linux203

  • MOC Member
  • *
  • Posts: 706
  • First Name (Displayed): Daniel
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #24 on: March 10, 2015, 07:19:18 PM »
Yes, misinformation that Obama is banning all rifle ammunition circulated. Panic buying of 5.56 and .223 has ensued.

I'm sitting on about 1,800 rounds of M193, but I shoot 250-300 a month.

I'm taking the class from ATHG in Adrian. 
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline gryphon

  • MOC Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3942
  • First Name (Displayed): Dan
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2015, 10:33:01 PM »
Why wait 'till August?  Take the class earlier and tell me how it is. :D

Offline linux203

  • MOC Member
  • *
  • Posts: 706
  • First Name (Displayed): Daniel
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2015, 11:38:46 PM »
Why wait 'till August?  Take the class earlier and tell me how it is. :D

I'm taking Defensive Carbine II, which is only in August September.  I'm also signed up for the Defensive Handgun II in August.  I took both the level 1 classes last fall.  Obviously, I liked them enough to sign up for more.  The two classes were very similar, just different weapon systems.  Started with basic weapon manipulation, moved to BSA drills, shooting positions, use of cover, moving off line of attack, malfunction handling, etc.

The carbine class was a blast and Glenn was really cool about it.  There were three other students that had a schedule conflict, so he pushed the class back a weekend.  They had another scheduling issue and the second instructor had to work, so it was just Glenn and I.  He gave me the heads up and checked if I was cool with 9 hours of one-on-one.

I burned through ~360 rifle and ~75 pistol rounds during the class.  BSA causes rounds to disappear fast.
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline gryphon

  • MOC Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3942
  • First Name (Displayed): Dan
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2015, 11:44:42 PM »
Had I known that I would have asked you to write an article about the Handgun I class for the MOC Newsletter!

I took Handgun I and II at MDFI.  I'd like to take a carbine class, maybe I'll check out ATHG.

Offline gryphon

  • MOC Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3942
  • First Name (Displayed): Dan
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #28 on: March 12, 2015, 10:37:56 AM »

Offline linux203

  • MOC Member
  • *
  • Posts: 706
  • First Name (Displayed): Daniel
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #29 on: March 12, 2015, 01:32:19 PM »
THAT IS AWESOME!!!!

I needed a good laugh today.
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline Jeff

  • Posts: 1166
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #30 on: March 12, 2015, 01:36:46 PM »
Where do I order the T-shirt!

Offline Xpiatio

  • Posts: 409
  • First Name (Displayed): Benjamin
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #31 on: March 12, 2015, 03:49:15 PM »
This administration is only making the cost of ammunition and firearms more expensive.  If he does that, then people with low economic standing will not be able to afford it.  I do wonder in the big picture, "if we over tax them and boost up the cost of gun industry products, that will then get guns off the street. In a way have gun control."

This could have race discrimination ties about what Bloomberg was thinking: getting guns out of the hands of "gangsters".

Offline gryphon

  • MOC Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3942
  • First Name (Displayed): Dan
Re: ATF Moves to Ban M855 And SS109 5.56 Ammunition
« Reply #32 on: March 12, 2015, 04:42:32 PM »
  If he does that, then people with low economic standing will not be able to afford it.

While true, it is also true that people with low economic standing are often disproportionately anti-gun.