Author Topic: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!  (Read 4314 times)

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Offline Pond Scum

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Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« on: July 30, 2015, 09:53:01 PM »
http://video.foxnews.com/v/4386758506001/kentucky-man-arrested-after-shooting-drone-out-of-sky/?intcmp=hpvid1#sp=show-clips

He says it was hovering over his yard and his neighbor's yard while his daughters were out back.  Claims he was protecting his property and privacy.  Daughters claim it wasn't the first time!

I say good for him!   :D

Offline steve jaye

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2015, 11:43:05 PM »
As an owner of a drone company this guy is screwed! You have zero expectation of privacy outside your home. Plus the FAA classifies drones as aircrafts and it's no difference than shooting at a plane.

Offline linux203

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2015, 10:00:20 AM »
As an owner of a drone company this guy is screwed! You have zero expectation of privacy outside your home. Plus the FAA classifies drones as aircrafts and it's no difference than shooting at a plane.

Aircraft, yes.  Unmanned Aircraft or Model Aircraft, depending on weight.  Not the same as an occupied plane.

It will be an interesting case to follow.
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2015, 06:29:12 AM »
http://www.wdrb.com/story/29675427/drone-owner-responds-to-claims-of-privacy-invasion

HILLVIEW, Ky. (WDRB) – The man flying the drone that was shot down Sunday -- creating nationwide headlines -- told his side of the story on Thursday.

David Boggs owns the drone and says he was the one flying on Sunday when Willie Merideth shot it down. Merideth cites his right to personal privacy as the reason he shot the drone down and claims the drone was hovering no more than 10 feet over his home.

“The bottom line is we didn't do it,” Boggs said in an interview with WDRB on Thursday, “We didn't hover, we didn't go down, we didn't do any of that. There's no way I'm going to fly below the trees the second day I owned it.”

Boggs says he bought the drone just a few days before it was shot down. He said he was planning on using it to shoot video of his kids riding motocross. He says Sunday was a practice session.

“There's no other explanation other than the truth,” Boggs said.

In video that Boggs claims shows the flight path an altitude of the drone, it shows the drone not dropping down to 10 feet.

"We are now 193 feet above the ground,” Boggs described as he showed us the flight path. “This area here is the world-famous drone slayer home, and this is a neighbor's home, and our friends live over here, and over here, and over here. You will see now that we did not go below this altitude -- we even went higher -- nor did we hover over their house to look in. And for sure didn't descend down to no 10 feet, or look under someone's canopy, or at somebody's daughter."

The track does show that the drone hovered for around 30 seconds near Merideth’s home but was at an altitude in excess of 200 feet.

Merideth says he shot the drone down with bird shot; an ammunition he says would not have caused enough damage to bring the drone down at an altitude of more than 200 feet.

“His claims are that the drone never got below 200 feet,” Merideth said on Thursday. “Number 8 bird shot is not going to take anything out at 200 feet.”

Boggs showed us the drone and said most of the damage didn’t happen because of the shot.

“The damage is not from the shell,” Boggs said. “It’s from the fall. When he shot, he hit one of the propellers.”

But the question remains, why was Boggs flying in the area in the first place?

“Number one, I was having fun with my friends and family,” Boggs answered. “Also my friend was in Vegas and he wanted me to fly over and get video of house.”

Boggs showed us a text message exchange he had on Sunday that backs up that story.

But Merideth stands by his claim that his privacy was being invaded.

“When someone is in the wrong they try and find a way to cover it up,” said Merideth of Boggs' claims.

Both Boggs and Merideth say they want to see the video that the drone captured but neither seems to know what happened to the memory card inside the drone that saved the video.

“The reason we don’t have the live footage is because when we got there where the drone was shot down and a neighbor had gone and retrieved it and the SD card was gone,” Boggs said. “We want that SD card.”

When asked, Merideth didn’t have an answer either.

“We have no idea where that's at,” he said.

Merideth is charged with wanton endangerment and criminal mischief for shooting down the drone and firing a weapon in a residential area. He is due in court again in September.
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline Marty

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2015, 07:53:44 AM »
It should also be noted, not that it may or may not be related to this story, that the Department of Homeland Security has sent an intelligence assessment to all police agencies across the country about drones being used as weapons in an attack. This included drug trafficking, and domestic terrorism.  I wonder if this could play in Merideth defence?
 http://wspa.com/2015/08/01/homeland-security-warns-drones-could-be-used-in-attacks/

Offline steve jaye

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Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2015, 02:16:49 AM »
Funny thing is that I can hop in a plane with a high zoom lens and take the same photos.

Drones just like firearms have a negative view with the media and public.

Offline Pond Scum

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2015, 08:29:06 AM »
Funny thing is that I can hop in a plane with a high zoom lens and take the same photos.

Drones just like firearms have a negative view with the media and public.

Yes, but your plane can't hover outside my bedroom window.  That may contribute to the negative "view" of drones at the moment .... plus new technology takes a while until people understand it or just get comfortable with it. 

It also depends upon the use of the drone and that may not be known in this instance until the flash drive contents come out.  Its okay to take pictures at the beach but if all your shots are close ups of teenage bikinis you would probably be in trouble.

There was quite a long thread over at MGO on drones and the legal opinion is that it is not legal to shoot down a drone.  It will be interesting to see how all of this and play out in new laws, in the courts and in regulations.

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2015, 08:48:10 AM »
A while back anti-hunting activists were flying drones with cameras over a private hunt club land and the hunters shot the drone down. I don't think anything happened to them. If I remember correctly the cops even made sure the activists stayed off the property including the drive. They were objecting to dove hunts.

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2015, 08:58:08 AM »
Oh yeah, forgot about the animal rights folks of SHARK and their efforts to prove that legal pigeon shoots violated animal cruelty laws:
http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Flying-Camera-From-Animal-Rights-Group-Shot-Down-at-Pigeon-Shoot-Cops-179983451.html

http://diydrones.com/profiles/blogs/hunters-shoot-down-mikrokopter-used-by-animal-rights-group-to-fil

http://www.suasnews.com/2012/11/19719/activists-drone-shot-out-of-the-sky-for-fourth-time/

There's a chapter about a live pigeon shoot in this book, starting around page 195. I don't know if that's how they do it these days, never been to one myself:
https://www.freedomsphoenix.com/Uploads/129/Media/Unintended_Consequences.pdf
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2015, 10:42:33 AM »
Unintended Consequences is a good book.  I bought it in hard cover when it first came out.  When did it become freely distributed on the web?

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2015, 10:52:24 AM »
I'm not sure that PDF is authorized by Mr Ross.
It's a not great OCR that apparently wasn't hand edited afterward, so DEA comes out DBA in most instances, stuff like that.

I have a hardcover too, but I believe there is a recent paperback edition, which would mean my hardcover is no longer worth $100.
Here it is, $28 at Amazon, so now you can get used hardcovers for around $70.
http://www.amazon.com/Unintended-Consequences-John-Ross/dp/1888118040

If you like Unintended Consequences, you should take a look at Matt Bracken's 'Enemies Trilogy', (and Mike Vanderboegh's 'Absolved' if he ever publishes it)
http://www.amazon.com/Matthew-Bracken/e/B00350B7EU/ref=dp_byline_cont_book_1

http://waronguns.blogspot.com/2008/07/absolved-banner-connector.html
« Last Edit: August 03, 2015, 09:39:32 PM by CitizensHaveRights »
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline steve jaye

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2015, 09:51:50 PM »
The drone wasn't hovering outside his window. It was almost 200' in the air.

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2015, 10:09:09 PM »
At what elevation is it permissible to video record in areas that people have a reasonable expectation of privacy?

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2015, 10:55:51 PM »
Well, apparently you have no privacy rights from satellites or FAA registered aircraft in approved flight patterns.

I'm thinking that if you have a barrier (trees, awning, roof) that protects you from line of sight to the old fashioned threats, flying a new fangled threat under that barrier should be a violation. Besides that, if you can reach it with a baseball bat it's gotta be too close.
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2015, 11:18:19 PM »
My question was addressed to Steve Jaye.

Offline Pond Scum

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2015, 12:20:13 AM »
The drone wasn't hovering outside his window. It was almost 200' in the air.

I didn't suggest that it was hovering outside the window in Kentucky .... I just said that a drone has the capability of hovering outside my bedroom window.  The plane you said you could hop in does not have the ability to hover by my window so using your plane analogy is not a valid comparison.   You own a drone company ... you should understand the vast differences between a plane and a drone far better than me. 

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2015, 07:01:48 PM »
Some quotes from this story:

The Federal Aviation Administration’s rules specify that drones may not “fly over people, except those directly involved with the flight.”

The U.S. Forest Service tallied 13 wildfires in which suspected drones interfered with firefighting aircraft this year — 11 since late June — up from four fires last year and only scattered incidents before. Last month, the sighting of five drones in a wildfire that closed Interstate 15 in Southern California and destroyed numerous vehicles grounded crews for 20 minutes as flames spread.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/08/10/this-fisherman-seemed-to-get-fed-up-with-a-drone-buzzing-around-a-pier-so-watch-how-he-decided-to-handle-it/

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #17 on: August 21, 2015, 03:58:26 PM »
I'd say if you're on your own property and you can down it with a t-shirt, no jury anywhere will make you pay for the damage.

If you're on public property, it might be safer to call the cops and tell them the damn thing is flying dangerously close to humans.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/08/20/man-vs-drone-vs-the-law/

1. Augustine Lehecka and his friends are at the beach.

2. A drone flies over them; according to Lehecka, the drone “was flying dangerously low,” with “its mounted camera swiveling back and forth apparently aimed at the group. He said he motioned for the drone to leave them alone, but it didn’t appear to work.”

3. Lehecka then threw his T-shirt at the drone. The T-shirt got caught in the drone’s propeller, which caused the drone to fall, and apparently caused $750 damage to the drone.

4. Lehecka was then arrested and charged with felony vandalism, and had to stay in jail overnight, though charges have now been dropped.

5. The pilot says the drone was flying “up high” above the ground, according to the NBC7 story; Lehecka says it can’t have been more than about 6 feet above him. It seems to me that if Lehecka downed it with his T-shirt, the drone can’t have been very high up, though I expect the distance could have been somewhat more than 6 feet.
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #18 on: August 21, 2015, 05:22:14 PM »
There are FAA rules about flying drones above people.  You're not supposed to do it.  If you are flying your drone close enough for someone to toss a t-shirt and hit it, you should be beaten.  The cops that arrested the t-shirt thrower should be reprimanded, at the very least.

The Federal Aviation Administration’s rules specify that drones may not “fly over people, except those directly involved with the flight.”

Offline MI_XD

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2015, 05:36:43 PM »
There are FAA rules about flying drones above people.  You're not supposed to do it.  If you are flying your drone close enough for someone to toss a t-shirt and hit it, you should be beaten.  The cops that arrested the t-shirt thrower should be reprimanded, at the very least.

The Federal Aviation Administration’s rules specify that drones may not “fly over people, except those directly involved with the flight.”

Please cite these rules, as they are supposedly "looking into" rules, but at this time there are none. They expect to have a set of rules in place in "about 2 years".

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Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2015, 08:05:26 PM »
Right now they are unenforceable by law, yes, but...  Six months ago they began looking at making them laws, not rules.

Honestly, though, what kind of creep flies a drone with a camera very low (10'-15' above ground) over people at the beach?

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2015, 08:19:49 PM »
I seem to recall rules for R/C aircraft, but I don't know if they were AMA rules (Academy of Model Aeronautics), government rules, or generally accepted rules (like Cooper's rules of gun handling). Under one of the three, flying over people would be a serious no-no, and your AMA insurance isn't going to cover you if you hurt somebody.

If those propellers are within 10' of somebody, I'd say your craft is clearly a physical threat. If it's more than 10', I don't see how that t-shirt is going to bring you down.
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2015, 08:20:18 PM »
I daresay the drone operator got off light.  If he had been standing there six feet away with a digital camera shooting pictures of the guy's girlfriend or wife in a bikini instead of getting his jollies off remotely with a drone camera he would have been the worse for wear.

And for all I know the drone was buzzing them dangerously low and recklessly as the man said.  The drone operator was obviously lying, so anything out of his piehole is suspect.

Offline Pond Scum

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2015, 10:06:57 PM »

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #24 on: August 21, 2015, 11:17:10 PM »
The pilot says he recorded the drone being hit by the shirt, but is not releasing that part of the video for now. He claims Lehecka attacked the drone as it was landing just a few feet off the sand.

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Drone-Dispute-Lands-Man-in-Jail-322232372.html

If you want a prize for having video evidence, how about you show us the relevant part of the video instead of just the irrelevant parts?

What's the battery life, and what's the flight duration at the point you say you were landing?
If the battery is more than 75% depleted, it adds to the believability of your claim that you were attacked while landing and not while simply flying low.

But, seriously, don't you fly your copter back to yourself before landing it?
Are you claiming that the guy followed the copter to you and then attacked it right in front of you as you were landing it?
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #25 on: August 22, 2015, 12:06:00 AM »
The drone operator is now changing his story.  Liar.  Oh, yeah, and to follow up to my previous post:

"FAA guidance says that model aircraft flights should be flown a sufficient distance from populated areas."

https://www.faa.gov/uas/faq/

"Don't fly near people."

https://www.faa.gov/uas/model_aircraft/

It's because of idiots like this guy who was probably standing in the bushes with his pants around his ankles that the FAA wants to change their guidance rules to laws with legal penalties which state, "drones may not fly over people, except those directly involved with the flight.”

If he would have kept to a higher elevation like was in his "released" video he wouldn't have had a problem.  But you go hovering a few feet above people with a camera and you're going to have a problem.  You go hovering outside a home window you're going to have a problem. 
« Last Edit: August 22, 2015, 12:11:29 AM by gryphon »

Offline part deux

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #26 on: August 22, 2015, 10:10:40 PM »
There is also a rule that says aircraft can not fly within 500' of a building or person, unless landing or taking off...  Wonder if you can extend that rule to a drone?

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2015, 04:52:09 PM »
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2015, 07:06:08 PM »
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #29 on: October 28, 2015, 10:56:56 PM »
Another one.

Judge dismisses charges for man who shot down drone in Kentucky.  “He had a right to shoot at this drone, and I’m gonna dismiss this charge.” With that, Judge Rebecca Ward gaveled the case against William Meredith to a close.

http://www.wdrb.com/story/30354128/judge-dismisses-charges-for-man-who-shot-down-drone

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #30 on: October 29, 2015, 07:47:57 AM »
She took everything the defendant said as fact and ignored everything the 'victim' said, despite the 'victim' supposedly having computer tracking evidence that said his drone was never over the defendant's property.

If she'd just said that facts were in dispute and there was no way to establish proof of anything beyond reasonable doubt, I'd be behind her 100%.

"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #31 on: October 29, 2015, 08:21:01 AM »
There were other eye witnesses who said the drone was below treetop level, not above it like the owner said.  The drone was close enough to shoot down.

Offline part deux

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #32 on: October 29, 2015, 11:29:05 AM »
Drones are in an untested area of the law

Photography is not a crime... Unless the person has a reasonable expectation of privacy, like a public cloth changing facility or bathroom.  Peeping tom rules come into play too.  FAA controls "flying" space above the land.

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #33 on: October 29, 2015, 12:32:59 PM »
I think in your fenced in backyard you have some expectation of privacy.  Especially inside your house.  A drone with a camera looking in your window?

Offline TheQ

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #34 on: October 29, 2015, 12:55:54 PM »

I think in your fenced in backyard you have some expectation of privacy.  Especially inside your house.  A drone with a camera looking in your window?

With this logic I can shoot down any 747 within 500 miles from my house as someone on the plane with good enough optics could be spying on me in my back yard that has a privacy fence.


...satellites too!
I Am Not A Lawyer (nor a gunsmith).

Offline gryphon

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Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #36 on: September 27, 2016, 05:10:43 PM »
The drone wasn't hovering outside his window. It was almost 200' in the air.

In the 1950's the courts ruled that it is only public airspace above 500 feet.

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #37 on: September 27, 2016, 08:09:50 PM »
Yet R/C craft are generally restricted to line of sight to the operator and 400' or less AGL, in order to keep them under control and away from passenger aircraft.
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline gryphon

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #38 on: September 27, 2016, 11:39:33 PM »
Which is fine.  You just don't fly YOUR aircraft onto someone else's property.

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #39 on: September 28, 2016, 08:14:33 AM »
Which is fine.  You just don't fly YOUR aircraft onto someone else's property.

Which is generally feasible with rotorcraft, but only if you have a large property if it's fixed wing.
But I don't think anybody really cares about airplanes, unless maybe now with all the 'drone' publicity they'd start getting upset about a sailplane circling in a thermal to gain altitude.
"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline Langenc

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Re: Man Shoots Down Drone in Kentucky!
« Reply #40 on: October 01, 2016, 09:52:04 PM »
So he wouldn't hover at a low altitude 'on the second day' he owned it. I wonder about the second week, month????