Author Topic: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced  (Read 2609 times)

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Offline bigt8261

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HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« on: February 03, 2016, 07:59:12 AM »
Press release: http://gophouse.org/gop-lawmakers-introduce-constitutional-carry-bills/

http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?2016-HB-5301
http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?2016-HB-5302
http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?2016-HB-5303
http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?2016-HB-5304

Overall, they seem like good bills. They are simple and well constructed. Basically, their main focus is eliminating the need to have a CPL to CC. The only downside is they leave 234d and 425o alone which likely helps the odds of the bills moving.

Offline Divegeek

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2016, 09:32:49 AM »
I like it. It also doesn't eliminate the CPL's so that people who want to carry out of state still have reciprocity. Because I live so close to the Ohio line, I would continue to keep my CPL active for that purpose.

Offline linux203

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2016, 05:55:30 PM »
Quote
Sec. 5o.

(1) Subject to subsection (5), an individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol, or who is exempt from licensure under section 12a(1)(h), shall not carry a concealed pistol on the premises of any of the following:

http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-28-425o
http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-28-432a

Given the language, I fail to see how 28.425o would apply to people carrying concealed without a CPL.  They are neither licensed under the act or exempt from licensure.  750.234d would absolutely apply to those without a CPL.
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline bigt8261

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2016, 08:34:54 AM »
Given the language, I fail to see how 28.425o would apply to people carrying concealed without a CPL.  They are neither licensed under the act or exempt from licensure.  750.234d would absolutely apply to those without a CPL.

It wouldn't. That was one of the problems with the original SB 442.

Offline linux203

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2016, 09:53:43 PM »
Let's assume that HB5301-5304 becomes law as introduced.  Let's also assume that MCL 28.422 is still in place (Federal GFSZA exemption).  A person obtains a license to possess a pistol (RI-10), but not a CPL.

They could not concealed (or open) carry in the places listed in MCL 750.234d.  There is not a perfect overlap with MCL 28.425o.  They could conceal carry in a school, an entertainment facility seating over 2,500 (as long as it is not a theatre or sports arena), and in a college dorm or classroom.

My point was there will be a list of places where a non-CPL holder can't carry (at all) and a different list where a CPL holder can't carry (concealed).  Let's get some consistency.  Align the two lists, or repeal both statutes.


When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are in peace. Luke 11:21

Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."  Luke 22:36

Offline bigt8261

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2016, 08:51:44 AM »
Let's assume that HB5301-5304 becomes law as introduced.  Let's also assume that MCL 28.422 is still in place (Federal GFSZA exemption).  A person obtains a license to possess a pistol (RI-10), but not a CPL.

They could not concealed (or open) carry in the places listed in MCL 750.234d.  There is not a perfect overlap with MCL 28.425o.  They could conceal carry in a school, an entertainment facility seating over 2,500 (as long as it is not a theatre or sports arena), and in a college dorm or classroom.

My point was there will be a list of places where a non-CPL holder can't carry (at all) and a different list where a CPL holder can't carry (concealed).  Let's get some consistency.  Align the two lists, or repeal both statutes.

You missed 750.237a, but other than that you are correct.

While those inconsistencies would be annoying, think of how much more glaring they would be and easier to fix should these bill pass. Sometimes it's better to attack a problem a piece at a time.

Offline part deux

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2016, 10:06:49 AM »
OMFG, this bill has brought the FUDDS out of the woodwork.

Offline bigt8261

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2016, 10:14:29 AM »
It very much has. The FB post from MCRGO announcing the bills has quite a few people saying no and that training should be mandated.  :SMH:

Offline CitizensHaveRights

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2016, 07:26:02 PM »
FOX 2 News:



"A well balanced breakfast being necessary to the start of a healthy day, the right of the people to keep and eat food shall not be infringed "  - Who has a right to keep and eat food, The People or A Well Balanced Breakfast?

Offline G36shooter

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2016, 08:22:04 PM »
It very much has. The FB post from MCRGO announcing the bills has quite a few people saying no and that training should be mandated.  :SMH:
Why sure. how many CPL instructors side with MCRGO?

Offline fozzy71

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Re: HB 5301-5304 - New Permitless Carry Bills Introduced
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2016, 09:47:42 PM »
It very much has. The FB post from MCRGO announcing the bills has quite a few people saying no and that training should be mandated.  :SMH:

The comments on their FB about the OC'er having his gun taken might cause you even more distress........