Author Topic: Changed my mind on Serpas.  (Read 24074 times)

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Offline BTAvery

  • Posts: 233
Re: Changed my mind on Serpas.
« Reply #20 on: October 29, 2010, 02:02:57 PM »

If you are aware of a law that requires someone to be an EMT to render first aid I would appreciate being directed to it.  I believe that under MI law I, persoanlly, am covered as I have been trained to the level of a medical first responder and have a degree as a physical therapist assistant which requires emergency medical education, both are positions in which I have "substantially met" the requirements for licensure even though I am licensed in neither.
Bronson (who, in the right circumstances, would give first aid to the person who attacked me)


I am a Michigan licensed EMT, if we are not working and witness an injury or someone needing medical assistance we are not required to give aid by law unless it is during hours that we are on the clock as an EMT. If it is something on time off you are not required to help but if you do give aid you are required to stay on scene with the patiend until somone with equal or greater training arrives and takes over. The "good samaritian law" states in brief that you can not be held responsible for what someone with the same amount of training and mind set would give the same patient under the same conditions.
I usually carry a med bag in my truck but since I have started to carry I have increased my stock in quick clot should something happen.

Thanks I meant to mention the stay on scene but forgot it. If you really want to know all about the laws take a first aid/cpr course any good instructor will cover the laws.

Offline Michigander

  • Posts: 57
Re: Changed my mind on Serpas.
« Reply #21 on: October 30, 2010, 12:07:22 AM »
I can see that being a problem with the draw from any holster.  In that oh crap death grip on the gun moment as soon as the gun cleared any holster your finger could go into the trigger guard just as easily.

Bronson

It's true to an extent, but the problem with the Serpa is that there is a mechanism for your trigger finger to actuate prior to firing. Worse yet, the motion is some what similar to a trigger pull, in that the finger has to be pressed in. The difference here is fine motor skills vs gross motor skills.

Having a conditioned response in the form of well practiced gross motor skills is as a matter of absolute fact something most adults count on to stay alive each and every day as they drive their cars. Most don't know racing techniques, but they get the idea of foot on the brake when they're about to hit something. It needs to be the very same way with carrying a gun. A set of conditioned gross motor skills.

Certain aspects of pistol defensive use can add fine motor skills, most notably reloading. A lot of people in combat situations end up needing like 10 seconds+ to do what could have been a 1.5 second mag swap because of fear and adrenalin. With some guns and some hand shapes, I would argue that the Serpa platform offers a similarly dangerous problem, except worse because it's possible that the first shot you fire might hit a high displacement vein in your leg, rather than maybe scoring 8 or 15 hits on your attackers.  :-\

I wish to again make it abundantly clear that I am not arguing with anyone who happily uses a Serpa. Certainly I didn't have these problems with Evil's XD45 in his serpa, at least not the trigger control issues and the way the gun draws. It is however a concern I now share with many others regarding the platform. Not really much else I can say on the matter that I haven't already brought up.

Offline Bronson

  • Posts: 554
Re: Changed my mind on Serpas.
« Reply #22 on: October 30, 2010, 01:10:27 AM »
the motion is some what similar to a trigger pull, in that the finger has to be pressed in.

I've stopped carrying with the Serpa because I like the Safariland better.  I wanted my lock release to be with the thumb since there's a good chance I'll have leather holster with a thumb-break...because I roll my own.  That being said when I was using the Serpa I found that it worked much more reliably if I did NOT make any extra effort to push the button.  I just gripped the gun with my finger alongside the holster, where it would be on any holster, and drew.  Just laying my finger on the button during the draw was all that was needed and indeed worked more effectively than attempting to push the button in any way.

Bronson
Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. – Thomas Paine

Offline emt805

  • Posts: 229
Re: Changed my mind on Serpas.
« Reply #23 on: October 30, 2010, 01:34:08 AM »
the motion is some what similar to a trigger pull, in that the finger has to be pressed in.

I've stopped carrying with the Serpa because I like the Safariland better.  I wanted my lock release to be with the thumb since there's a good chance I'll have leather holster with a thumb-break...because I roll my own.  That being said when I was using the Serpa I found that it worked much more reliably if I did NOT make any extra effort to push the button.  I just gripped the gun with my finger alongside the holster, where it would be on any holster, and drew.  Just laying my finger on the button during the draw was all that was needed and indeed worked more effectively than attempting to push the button in any way.
Bronson

I have to agree that it is just a swipe on the button as you motion to remove pistol from the holster, no extra steps or buttons to press just a natural fluent motion.

Offline BTAvery

  • Posts: 233
Re: Changed my mind on Serpas.
« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2010, 11:18:15 AM »
I see what the one guys talking about if you push the button it does actually make you want to put your finger into the trigger guard but with the brush the button draw it seemed to be fine.