Michigan Open Carry, Inc.
Open Carry Specific => OC Experiences => Topic started by: Evil Creamsicle on May 24, 2010, 12:42:08 AM
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The prelude to this story is that I went bowling with some friends. Michigander is going to wish he'd come along now...
At the bowling alley, the manager asked me to conceal, but as there is a bar there I told him it was illegal. He was OK with it but asked if he could move us to another lane [away from the people who complained] and specifically said 'no I don't want you to leave, you didn't do anything wrong.' He was just trying to appease everyone.
So, Duggan's...
I really really wanted a Big Chief... like big time. So we went there. After ordering and sitting around for a few minutes, the manager comes up. He seemed OK at first. He asked me if I was licensed to carry. I said yes, and he asked me if he could see it.
Against my better judgement I showed him my CPL, figuring if he knew I had it he would be less likely to call the police.
So, then he calls ROPD.
Then he comes back and tells me I can't carry there. It is a bar, sure, but I was OCing with CPL, so I was legal. He said that ROPD said differently.
I was content to leave, figuring that the restaurant owner would be reasonable to take the police's word over mine, but I did enlighten him that he was misinformed and that I knew the law and was well within it.
But then he had to go be an asshole and act like he was a law expert all of a sudden.
I said I knew the law and he said 'well then why are you bringing that in here??'
...so I asked him for a to go box with a very '**** you' look on my face, and made sure to promptly leave and give my girlfriend the pen for the charge slip.
She put a big fat obvious zero where the tip goes, and personally handed it to the bartender. I love her ;D
I want to send both ROPD and Duggan's a letter, and at least Duggan's some info. I know from personal experience that ROPD knows better... bastards.
Anyway... thats my story
Oh the funniest part!
I took my food, and went in the parking lot [not having been officially asked to leave, but rather told to put the gun in the car] and opened up the tailgate and finished my meal, now I'm posting this on my laptop using their WiFi... muahahaha!
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Bummer. That's no fun, but at least you got to eat!
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... and got the last word in! ;)
It sounds like a good end to a less than positive encounter with the locals. Congratulations!
Roy
8)
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Yes, follow through with this one. If possible, insist that the police correct their mistakes.
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Stick to your guns... so to speak. You were right. Except one little misconception...
At the bowling alley, the manager asked me to conceal, but as there is a bar there I told him it was illegal.
It is only illegal to conceal in an establishment that receives a majority of its income from serving alcohol by the glass...
Since the bar in a bowling alley is unlikely to actually provide the majority of its income, you could have legally concealed it there... as long as you weren't drinking of course. Technically, you were in a bowling alley, not a bar or tavern.
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Even in a bar the owner or owner's representative can give permission to conceal as long as you have a CPL
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Even in a bar the owner or owner's representative can give permission to conceal as long as you have a CPL
As much as I would like to think your comment is true and only makes sense, but it is not the law as I see it.
While it's true that Section 234d contains an exemption which allows possession of fireams on the premises of a bar with permission from the owner(s) or agent(s) or for those who have a CPL, Section 5o has no such exemption for CPL holders to CC with said permission. Under Section 227, there's an exemption for a non-CPL holder to CC if he/she/they are the owner(s) of the bar.
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Gotta go with SpringerXDacp on this one. As I read it the only entity that can give a CPL holder permission to conceal in one of the concealed pistol free zones is the presiding official(s) of a place of worship.
http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(cu5qm3zmdq51ta55cynq1w55))/mileg.aspx?page=GetObject&objectname=mcl-28-425o (http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(cu5qm3zmdq51ta55cynq1w55))/mileg.aspx?page=GetObject&objectname=mcl-28-425o)
(e) Any property or facility owned or operated by a church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship, unless the presiding official or officials of the church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship permit the carrying of concealed pistol on that property or facility.
There is no such provision in sub-section d.
(d) A bar or tavern licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, where the primary source of income of the business is the sale of alcoholic liquor by the glass and consumed on the premises. This subdivision does not apply to an owner or employee of the business. The Michigan liquor control commission shall develop and make available to holders of licenses under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, an appropriate sign stating that "This establishment prohibits patrons from carrying concealed weapons". The owner or operator of an establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, may, but is not required to, post the sign developed under this subdivision. A record made available by an establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, necessary to enforce this subdivision is exempt from disclosure under the freedom of information act, 1976 PA 442, MCL 15.231 to 15.246.
Bronson
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Agree with the last two posts. Section 750.234d does give the bar owner permission to possess a firearm but Section 28.425o prohibits the firearm being concealed. Therefore the only legal option is Open Carry.