Author Topic: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized  (Read 16375 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline bigt8261

  • MOC President
  • MOC Board Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1482
    • Michigan Open Carry, Inc
  • First Name (Displayed): Tom
I was notified that Mayor Heartwell reacted to our recent seminar this morning.

Quote
Since last we met as a City Commission – according to the online resource Wikipedia – there have been nine school shootings, and at least one movie theatre and one mall shooting in the United States. If that pace continues it will outstrip last year’s reported 31 school shootings. Since January 1, 2000, there have been a reported 119 school shootings in the (United States). How could we forget the 6-year-old boy in Flint who brought his uncle’s gun to school and killed his little 6-year-old classmate because, as he said, “I don’t like her.”

In Grand Rapids there have been 23 reports of gunshots and 3 shooting victims since January 1.

There have been uncounted numbers of suicides by gun in the country since last we met, but, if averages hold up, then 1,119 people have turned their guns on themselves and taken their lives in the last three weeks. Just over half of all suicides are by gun.

There is estimated to be 310 million guns in this country. That is one gun for every man, woman and child in the nation, save 9 million. Many of those guns are owned by unstable people or are owned by others in the homes of unstable people in which guns are readily available. The Congress of the United States has failed its responsibility to protect us from those dangerous and mentally unstable people. Every American citizen is at risk today because of our lax and irresponsible gun laws. We even had an illustration in our neighboring community of Lowell of two licensed gun carriers drawing on each other after a road rage incident. Both are dead.

I sit in our City Commission meeting week after week anxious and frightened because a civilian with a gun is in this chamber. I know that he can kill me, and probably others at this table or in these chambers, before the police officer in the rear of the room can react. Carrying a gun always, always represents the threat to use that gun to kill or maim another. That, after all, is why these people carry their guns.

Now the gun advocates want to “desensitize” the community to open carry. The more guns we see, they say, the less we will fear them or the people carrying them. Well, I will never be desensitized and God help us all if society accepts those bullying tactics as the norm.

I urge all citizens who feel as I do to take action. Arm yourselves with the righteousness of our position. If you see an armed person come into a store or restaurant, alert others and leave the establishment. If you see an armed person in a shopping mall or movie theatre, alert security and leave the building. If you see an armed person approaching a school, call the police. You see we can never know what that individual’s intention may be. We must always err on the side of public safety rather than regretting later, when people are dead, that we didn’t act.

Offline Raggs

  • Posts: 262
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2014, 12:34:54 PM »
OMG, Heartwell is a woman! And a weak one at that. BTW where did he say this?

Offline FASBOLD

  • Posts: 194
  • First Name (Displayed): Larry
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2014, 12:42:05 PM »
Congress has also failed to protect us from people who say, do, and believe things with which we disagree.

There is a very good reason for this, it's called natural rights that are recognized by the Bill of Rights.

He does have a point that if we carry a gun, it is because we are prepared to use it. However, he assumes that those who carry a gun are somehow under its influence and have no free will to use it for good.

Hartwell just has a long winded way of saying, "You can't make me change, so there!  :P"

He seems to believe that the magic power of a LEO's uniform is the only thing that counters the evil influence of a gun.

The magical thinking of those who are anti-gun (more like anti-gun for civilians), is striking. Most of them, in my experience, are the kind of "liberal" who claim to want evidence for everything, but this idea that a gun is inherently bad has a strong hold on them. How to convince them that guns don't have magical powers eludes me. Their minds are made up, don't confuse them with facts; especially facts that counter their point of view.

Since so many anti-gunners think that a gun makes people use them for evil, why aren't more of them being locked up for delusions? Obviously, if they get their hands on a gun, they will be a danger to themselves and others. Isn't that what they are saying?

Pro Gun: Follow the 4 safety rules. Anti Gun: Guns are bad/evil and make people do bad things.

How much of the anti-gun argument can be offset by the gun safety rules?

An emphasis on gun safety would go a long way for accidents and such. Why aren't their public service announcements for gun safety that employ the 4 rules?

"The people of these United States are the rightful masters of both Congresses and courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."
~ Abraham Lincoln
                     ****
"Too young to die, too old to take an ass whippin'."
~ Unknown

Offline SD40VE

  • SE Region Posse
  • Posts: 996
  • New Haven, Macomb County
  • First Name (Displayed): Bradley
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2014, 12:51:39 PM »
"I sit in our City Commission meeting week after week anxious and frightened because a civilian with a gun is in this chamber. I know that he can kill me, and probably others at this table or in these chambers, before the police officer in the rear of the room can react. Carrying a gun always, always represents the threat to use that gun to kill or maim another. That, after all, is why these people carry their guns."

"these people"
"what do you mean you people!!!"


" If you see an armed person in a shopping mall or movie theatre, alert security and leave the building. If you see an armed person approaching a school, call the police."
seriosuly? this guy has issues...
he never mentions the times when citizen intervention with a handgun has saved lives. imagine the guy in alabama who took the family dollar hostage? were there not a CPL carrying person that could have been a huge murder spree.

im thinking he has special interests in his pocket and thats why he is so intolerant of LAC's with firearms

Offline Pond Scum

  • MOC Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 409
  • First Name (Displayed): Glenn
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2014, 12:52:46 PM »
OMG, Heartwell is a woman! And a weak one at that. BTW where did he say this?

Tuesday mornings on Commission meeting days the commission meets to discuss business in a less formal setting.  They are open meetings.

I'm guessing if he said it there.

Strangely all of his shootings happened in Gun Free Zones proving that gun laws don't work to stop criminals.  Sigh.

Offline Xpiatio

  • Posts: 409
  • First Name (Displayed): Benjamin
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2014, 12:56:49 PM »
So how many accidents have cars caused in the last year? Does Heartwell walk down the sidewalk dodging behind a tree each time a car drives by?  Although he does bring up a good point, a person can cause another human being harm before the police can intervene. I carry because I don't want to use it.  It is my last resort. I learned all to well 2 to 3 years ago walking a street in kalamazoo.  I was blind sided by someone doing their "knockout game" for an entry into a gang.  I always assumed that I wouldn't be a victim cause I am a big guy. It took the cops a while to get there. My saving grace was not the cops (who have not caught the assailant and won't) but were my friends who came running back. I could alone have been jumped by the assailant and a whole group of his "gang".  It gets one thinking about their safety and how prepared they can be went it hits the fan.

On another note, Mr Heartwell worked for Aquinas College. Why is he quoting Wikipedia when we all know high learning institutions do not recognize Wikipedia as a credible source?
« Last Edit: January 28, 2014, 01:06:01 PM by Xpiatio »

Offline TucTom

  • MOC Member
  • *
  • Posts: 565
  • First Name (Displayed): Tom
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2014, 01:07:04 PM »
Strangely all of his shootings happened in Gun Free Zones proving that gun laws don't work to stop criminals.  Sigh.

I have decided I will not bring up that "GFZ's" and shootings prove the laws don't work. (well they do work in the case of allowing a defenseless shooting)

I am now only saying to people that it is too that bad by law or rule someone with a gun couldn't be there to protect and or prevent...... I figure we as gun owners should "spin" it to better our position. Anyone else have a way of Spinning?

Offline TheQ

  • Website Content Manager
  • MOC Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4263
    • Michigan Open Carry, Inc.
  • First Name (Displayed): Phillip
Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2014, 01:19:22 PM »

OMG, Heartwell is a woman! And a weak one at that. BTW where did he say this?

I have two women in my life who are very near and dear to me that are both gun owners....
I Am Not A Lawyer (nor a gunsmith).

Offline Raggs

  • Posts: 262
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2014, 01:26:23 PM »
I have two women in my life who are very near and dear to me that are both gun owners....

Which is why i added "weak ones at that" I have met your wife, nothing weak about her. My wife owns a gun as well, she is also not weak.

Offline Xpiatio

  • Posts: 409
  • First Name (Displayed): Benjamin
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2014, 01:27:58 PM »
Which is why i added "weak ones at that" I have met your wife, nothing weak about her. My wife owns a gun as well, she is also not weak.

I feel for you Raggs.  i had a feeling someone might bring this up.

Offline bigt8261

  • MOC President
  • MOC Board Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1482
    • Michigan Open Carry, Inc
  • First Name (Displayed): Tom
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2014, 01:30:46 PM »
Naturally, I will be working on a response for tonight's public Commission meeting. Which is at 7pm at City Hall, BTW.

Offline bigt8261

  • MOC President
  • MOC Board Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1482
    • Michigan Open Carry, Inc
  • First Name (Displayed): Tom

Offline Raggs

  • Posts: 262
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2014, 01:40:15 PM »
Naturally, I will be working on a response for tonight's public Commission meeting. Which is at 7pm at City Hall, BTW.

Be sure to bring George an extra pair of depends

Offline Xpiatio

  • Posts: 409
  • First Name (Displayed): Benjamin
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2014, 01:48:40 PM »
Be sure to bring George an extra pair of depends

Not able to go?

Offline Raggs

  • Posts: 262
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2014, 01:50:00 PM »
Not able to go?

That or I can't afford to buy depends for GH

Offline SD40VE

  • SE Region Posse
  • Posts: 996
  • New Haven, Macomb County
  • First Name (Displayed): Bradley
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2014, 03:17:55 PM »
and i see a vid of tom there. good to put a face to the wisdom

Offline gryphon

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 4038
  • First Name (Displayed): Dan


Offline CV67PAT

  • MOC Charter Member
  • Posts: 2615
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2014, 03:34:18 PM »
OMG, Heartwell is a woman! And a weak one at that. BTW where did he say this?
That is a blatant sexist remark. And to qualify it with "a weak one at that" further demonstrates a lack of judgement which hampers efforts to attract women into the firearm's community.
Want to keep informed of events in your area? Go to http://www.miopencarry.org/update

Offline Michigun

  • Posts: 21
Re: Grand Rapids Mayor Geroge Heartwell Doesn't Want To Be Desensitized
« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2014, 05:00:23 PM »
No need for the off color commentary about the mayor, as any comments made on this forum are able to be viewed by anyone and there is no sense in validating any negative perceptions about the open carry crowd.

I'm not a GR resident, nor am I going to be at the meeting tonight, but I do have a question that I would like to see posed to the mayor.  The mayor states he is frightened knowing that a resident in the meeting room has a gun, so I wonder if he would be less frightened if he didn't know who in the room may or may not have a gun.